View Full Version : Arion's Rift
Gazza_N
28-11-2009, 06:32 PM
Arion's Rift
A tactical action-RPG thing by Gazza_N
Arion's Rift is a tactical action RPG that's the end result of endless requests to improve on my earlier Gears of War JRPG (http://forums.tidemedia.co.za/nag/showthread.php?t=10928). In Arion's Rift, I'm attempting to take the systems and ideas I used in GRPG, expand them, and transplant them to a sci-fi setting of my own.
First things first, though. I'm starting exactly where I started with GRPG - with a combat system prototype. It's still a turn-based affair that incorporates a lot of GRPG's systems, but the interface has had a complete overhaul, and some things may not work exactly the same way as you remember:
> Viewpoint: You're looking top-down now. Don't get confused.
> Movement: You can now move your characters around. Glee! The pathfinding is kinda shoddy right now, but stuff works the way it should, barring mysteriously circular routes.
> Cover: Cover still provides... cover, but it can be negated if you fire at enemies from the correct angle. If an enemy is in cover, but you can get a clear shot BEHIND the cover, it can't help them. Just like in a shooter.
> Health Regeneration: avoid taking damage between turns, and you gain health at the start of your next turn, whether you're ducked behind cover or not.
> Interface: Played The Sims? Understand how its context-sensitive popup menus work? Of course you have. Good. You're sorted.
Regarding Special Attacks - not implemented yet. For now, you only have one attack, but SP and special attacks will return in the form of the mysterious "Backlash" minigame. Stay posted.
Proto 1
Please give the Arion's Rift Combat Prototype a shot and let me know what you think, as well as notifying me of any bugs you find. You can download it here (http://sites.google.com/site/gazzagamesrepository/Home/ArionsRiftP1.zip?attredirects=0&d=1), for a paltry 1.2 MB. Hit F1 while it's running to pull up the hugely entertaining help/tutorial wall-o-text.
Proto 2
Updated with all manner of goodness. Get it heah (http://sites.google.com/site/gazzagamesrepository/Home/Arion%27sRiftP2.zip?attredirects=0&d=1) for some ridiculously petty amount of cap, and don't forget to read the readme!
BlackShipsFillt
28-11-2009, 10:06 PM
It's a nice little prototype, using the terrain provides a decent variety of strategies... It could even provide some decent puzzles, depending on the layout of the terrain...
It does seem to hang though, when the enemy is down to two and it gets to the middle enemy, he just can't seem to decide what to do.
Would love to see this develop further!
Gazza_N
29-11-2009, 08:35 PM
Thanks for your comments, BlackShips (and for all the comments I've got from others over GTalk). Sorry about that hanging AI bug, everyone - amazing what a single misplaced scope bracket will do. >.<
So far, people seem to like the context-menu-based interface, which makes me a very happy Gazza indeed. I wanted to steer away from clunky menu bars to free up screen space, but keep things elegant. I have some ideas to make available items for selection a little clearer, though, instead of forcing the player to mouse over everything to determine what they can do. Perhaps having items that can be interacted with in the current turn glow a little will clarify actions.
Any other comments or suggestion would be greatly appreciated. For now, AI fixings, and some interface work.
Nandrew
30-11-2009, 03:57 PM
Righto, I'll get on this!
... as soon as I get back to a betrar Internets connection. My download keeps breaking. :(
But it sounds cool, looks like you're going to be putting extra in all the right places. :)
Nandrew
06-12-2009, 10:32 PM
So, you've made it spatially-oriented now. Iiiiinteresting. I like that a lot.
Fengol
07-12-2009, 09:19 AM
There's definitely a problem with where you put your menu items. I wanted to shoot with a character but when I clicked on them there was nothing, only later did I find the action was on the enemy.
So you need to think about how your actions are laid out and keep consistant. My feeling is to put all the actions on the object that can do the action; so shoot would be on my dudes, and then I would click on the object I want to shoot.
Gazza_N
08-12-2009, 08:50 AM
\o/ This is why I'm prototyping, folks. I need to know if the more unorthodox stuff I'm trying here really works or not.
Perhaps I should explain my thinking behind the menus, and you guys can tell me if I'm on the right track or not:
Traditional RPG interfaces are very similar to ye olde Adventure game interface. You select a verb, and then select the object you want to perform it on. Like an adventure game, it sometimes isn't clear what verbs can be used where, or you have so many verbs, items and submenus that the interface becomes a hopelessly cluttered user-friendliness apocalypse (Final Fantasy, I'm looking at you with blazing red eyes). It also takes far more clicks to navigate. Even GRPG suffered from these drawbacks, and it had a far more toned-down menu system than the games it was based on.
On the other hand, think of this system as a verb coin. You click the object, you select a verb. Verbs will always have context - friendlies will list buffs and assists, the active character will list their specific moves, enemies will have attacks listed. You'll need, for the most part, two clicks to perform an action (three in the case of movement). This strikes me as far more elegant and, more importantly, faster-paced. I want to keep combat snappy this time around, and an efficient interface means things happen faster.
One thing I can and will DEFINITELY do is give the player a better idea of what they can interact with, especially since nobody seems to read the help when I ask them to (:<). There are some rather elaborate rules for object selection involving line-of-sight and (as soon as I finish implementing it) weapons range, for instance. By providing visual clues (such as coloured haloes or shading or icons) I can more effectively convey "HEY! HEY! YOU CAN TOTALLY CLICK THIS!" to the player.
It's experimental and unorthodox, yes, but I think it's more efficient, especially once I've expanded the move set with special attacks, buffs, and such.
Commentses?
UntouchableOne
08-12-2009, 10:57 AM
I like the prototype, it takes a swing or two to get a hang of it but it's a nice tactical prototype. What do you think of allowing one green action then one red action etc...instead of all green actions then all red actions? That way you can derive a different strategy depending on what the previous red dot did.
Gazza_N
08-12-2009, 11:56 AM
Welcome back, UntouchableOne! S'been a while! :D
Thanks, that's a totally valid point. The truth is that I'm still not entirely sure how I'm going to handle combat initiative. I'll probably end up linking it to the Speed stat, making faster characters move sooner in the turn cycle, but for now you'll just have to live with the us-then-them progression. ;)
dislekcia
08-12-2009, 12:02 PM
\o/ This is why I'm prototyping, folks. I need to know if the more unorthodox stuff I'm trying here really works or not.
Perhaps I should explain my thinking behind the menus, and you guys can tell me if I'm on the right track or not:
Traditional RPG interfaces are very similar to ye olde Adventure game interface. You select a verb, and then select the object you want to perform it on. Like an adventure game, it sometimes isn't clear what verbs can be used where, or you have so many verbs, items and submenus that the interface becomes a hopelessly cluttered user-friendliness apocalypse (Final Fantasy, I'm looking at you with blazing red eyes). It also takes far more clicks to navigate. Even GRPG suffered from these drawbacks, and it had a far more toned-down menu system than the games it was based on.
On the other hand, think of this system as a verb coin. You click the object, you select a verb. Verbs will always have context - friendlies will list buffs and assists, the active character will list their specific moves, enemies will have attacks listed. You'll need, for the most part, two clicks to perform an action (three in the case of movement). This strikes me as far more elegant and, more importantly, faster-paced. I want to keep combat snappy this time around, and an efficient interface means things happen faster.
One thing I can and will DEFINITELY do is give the player a better idea of what they can interact with, especially since nobody seems to read the help when I ask them to (:<). There are some rather elaborate rules for object selection involving line-of-sight and (as soon as I finish implementing it) weapons range, for instance. By providing visual clues (such as coloured haloes or shading or icons) I can more effectively convey "HEY! HEY! YOU CAN TOTALLY CLICK THIS!" to the player.
It's experimental and unorthodox, yes, but I think it's more efficient, especially once I've expanded the move set with special attacks, buffs, and such.
Commentses?
I think you're on to something really cool with this concept for a UI. Keep going with it.
I would suggest emphasising the LOS stuff with some indication of "pointing" to/from verbs from the selected character. Maybe a stretched graphic or surreptitious arrow in the direction of a possible action, etc.
dammit
08-12-2009, 12:25 PM
I totally read the help file. Well, some of it at least... :P hehe
But yeah, I have to say I really like the interface system. Once you're aware of how it works, it really makes so much sense. Of course, I was still totally obliterated by the red dots on several occasions, but thats not a bad sign at all ;)
UntouchableOne
08-12-2009, 04:44 PM
Welcome back, UntouchableOne! S'been a while! :D
Thanks, that's a totally valid point. The truth is that I'm still not entirely sure how I'm going to handle combat initiative. I'll probably end up linking it to the Speed stat, making faster characters move sooner in the turn cycle, but for now you'll just have to live with the us-then-them progression. ;)
Yup, its been loooooong...campus got hectic and drinking etc got in the way of productivity but I'm eager to get back into it. I look forward to seeing this game progress.
BlackShipsFillt
08-12-2009, 04:57 PM
Is there a plan to make the enemies move?
I imagine this would be very tricky to get working but the tactical payoff would be massive. Imagine enemies that need to fight melee style, or enemies that that flee in terror.
Gazza_N
15-12-2009, 08:47 AM
Yup, I'm totally looking at getting enemies to move, although I'm still looking at what their exact behaviour will be (not to mention the specifics of implementing their AI :P). Mobility's a big part of the combat, and it would be a shame if enemies couldn't make use of it too. I'm looking at quick melee/short-range enemies, like you've suggested, as well as larger, nastier ones that are heavily-armed, but are slow and can't make use of cover.
Gazza_N
11-01-2010, 08:05 PM
Oh me, oh my. It has been a while, hasn't it? In between exploding computers, wrangling a full set of components to build new, non-exploding computers, and the usual Christmas shopping and travel requirements, there hasn't been a lot of chance to get some solid coding time into the game. Lots of pen 'n' paper dev, yes, but that isn't really a whole lot of fun to play.
If you make your merry way to the first post, you'll find a link to the latest version (Prototype 2). This latest prototype contains the following exciting features:
> New movement rules and mechanics: Also known as "proper A* pathfinding and its associated benefits". Units no longer move anywhere within a set radius, they move a set number of tiles instead, like in Real RPGs(tm). They also don't get stuck in circular loops anymore.
> Weapons ranging: Yes indeedy. Weapons now have a limited range, but they also allow for Point Blank attacks for nearby enemies, which means a guaranteed hit.
> UI tweaks: Same context menu mechanic as before, but now you can see at a glance what stuff you can click on thanks to handy visual prompts, rather than mousing over random entities experimentally. I've also reconfigured and added HUD elements around controllable units.
> AI tweaks: The AI is generally smarter, and it can move its units around to get them within range and LOS of targets. This is dictated by a randomised Bravery stat, BTW, so if an enemy decides to stay in one place, nothing's broken - he's just a pansy. :P I do need to add some self-preservation behaviour, though. Enemies still don't run back to cover if heavily injured.
So that's it. Link in first post, and please read the Readme for the updated rules and controls. Pretty please? ;_;
Nandrew
12-01-2010, 12:30 AM
Awesome stuff! I like the more vigorously defined grid and I like the meaningful, thinky sort of combat that you're bringing about (with just the right dose of action-minigame goodness, mind you).
I also like those subtle friendly points, like giving the player a countdown warning for Backlash. It's coming along nicely, overall.
Fengol
12-01-2010, 08:02 AM
Is it not possible to convert movement and stuff to action points because I'd still like to move and shoot in one go. If you give me action points and say moving a step costs 1 point and shooting is 3 or something then I can run to cover and shoot from there, or close the distance and shoot. Alternatively shoot then run for cover.
In the end you can go the whole X-Com route and blind firing is cheap with regards to action points while an aimed shot has better accuracy but costs more.
Gazza_N
12-01-2010, 08:33 AM
@Nandrew: \o/. I'm hoping that once different weapons, abilities and stats management are thrown into the mix that it'll become a far more thinky experience. But see below...
@Fengol: Heh. By this point, enough people have requested Action Points (or some sort of "shoot and move in the same turn" mechanic) that I can't ignore it anymore. ;) It shouldn't be too hard to convert the existing system to an AP-based one, and it really won't impact any of the existing mechanics much. It should also result in shorter combat rounds, which isn't a bad thing. Lemme play around with it.
Fengol
12-01-2010, 08:45 AM
well, don't forget different weapons can have different costs but PLEASE also have the Overwatch ability (i.e. the ability to reserve AP to fire 1 Blindfire shot at an opposing enemy during their turn when they move through the unit's LOS)
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