View Full Version : 22: Gears of War as a JRPG
Gazza_N
02-06-2009, 01:29 PM
22: Gears of War as a JRPG
By Gazza_N
Join Marcus Fenix, EmoDom Santiago and the rest of Delta Squad as they trawl through the Hollow on an epic quest for wives and fights!
The game will play like most JRPGs - a top-down exploration mode with a side-view turn-based combat mode when you get into fights. Cover will be assumed in the combat (all characters will be behind cover by default), so there's no need to find any - you just need to use it effectively.
Combat is simple: you're either in cover, or out. Switching cover modes is a major action, taking your full turn. In cover, you'll regenerate a portion of hit points every turn, but can't fire anything. Out of cover, you can fire your weapon, but are vulnerable to enemy fire. Naturally, the Locust will work the same way. You'll need to keep an eye on your ammo and reload occasionally, which brings up an Active Reload bar. A successful active reload increases your Special Attack bar, which allows you to use mortars, grenades, the immortal chainsaw, the Hammer of Dawn (outside) or even the dreaded COLE TRAIN HORSEY ATTACK in caves. Should one of your members be knocked down, you need to use a unit of Fenix Down to bring them back up to combat readiness. Characters will level up as they go, increasing their health and unlocking special attacks and the ability to use new weapons.
Sprites will be provided by the ever-awesome Azimuth "Azimuth" Azimuth.
http://s138.photobucket.com/albums/q258/azimuth666/delta.jpg
Prototype soooooon...
Releases:
*WIP*
Combat Prototype 1.1 (http://sites.google.com/site/gazzagamesrepository/Home/GoWRPGp101.zip?attredirects=0) (1.2MB ZIP. Totally fixed, yo. I hope...)
Super Gear of War Adventure XD Advance Alpha III Combat Prototype 2 (http://sites.google.com/site/gazzagamesrepository/Home/GoWRPGp201.zip?attredirects=0) (1.5MB ZIP) PRESS F1 FOR HELP. PRESS F1 FOR HELP. PRESS F1 FOR HELP. Also, press F1 for Help.
*FINAL*
Super Gear of War XD Advance Alpha III Final (http://sites.google.com/site/gazzagamesrepository/Home/GoWRPGFinal.zip?attredirects=0). (2MB ZIP) Game instructions in the readme.
*REAL FINAL*
Super Gear of War XD Advance Alpha III Totally Real Final Version Gaiden 360-exty-six! (http://sites.google.com/site/gazzagamesrepository/Home/GoWRPGTotallyRealFinal.zip?attredirects=0) (2MB ZIP) Once again, game instructions in the Readme.
Cleric
02-06-2009, 01:39 PM
Awesome awesome awesome idea. Sure, it violates copy rights, but there are ways around that. Love the Cole sprite.
Gazza_N
02-06-2009, 02:01 PM
Heh, well, every game in this comp will violate copyright to an extent, but since we aren't selling them or stealing assets from the originals, we can classify them as fan games. ;)
Azimuth
02-06-2009, 02:02 PM
http://s138.photobucket.com/albums/q258/azimuth666/dom.jpg
Cleric
02-06-2009, 02:09 PM
Epic. Win.
Fengol
02-06-2009, 02:11 PM
What are you making it in?
On the combat, if you look at some of the FF characters, their special skill was mini-mini-game (like Setzer's Slot ability which ran a slot machine) you must see if you can include that in either the characters or the weapons.
*Waaaaah* I want sprites from Azimuth "Azimuth" Azimuth the Azimuth.
Gazza_N
02-06-2009, 02:16 PM
I'll go for GM, since that's what I know, and it'll give me the flexibility I need. As for the minigames, I was thinking of having them for special attacks, a-la Penny Arcade Adventures. Button-mashing for the chainsaw (how apt! :P), some form of aiming minigame for the Hammer, stuff like that.
Tr00jg
02-06-2009, 02:18 PM
AWESOME! Love the cover aspect.
Kensei
02-06-2009, 05:10 PM
Looks good, Gaz :)
If you need some help writing some dialogue I would be happy to help (considering most of this game WILL be just dialogue and cut scenes, amirite?)*
What kind of missions are you planning to do?
Collect the 'Golden Lancer' type thing?
* = This writing service is not limited to Gazza_N's game, I would be happy to assist with any of your guys games :)
Nandrew
02-06-2009, 05:47 PM
* = This writing service is not limited to Gazza_N's game, I would be happy to assist with any of your guys games :)
Are you sure about that? (http://forums.tidemedia.co.za/nag/showthread.php?t=10934)
Also: damn you Gaz, you snagged an artist?
Gazza_N
02-06-2009, 05:50 PM
More like the artist snagged me. <_<
Gazza_N
07-06-2009, 10:09 PM
As promised, I've slapped a prototype together over the weekend. For now I've started work on the combat system, since that's the most important and finicky part of this project, so that's what you'll be playing in this proto. My apologies to those people who wanted to see the "Run around and talk to people about stuff" portion instead. :P
Link in first post, and you can hit F1 for controls and instructions once the game is running. Anyone who's played any form of JRPG shouldn't have any hassles, though. ;)
All comments, complaints and suggestions are welcome, naturally. Except for the graphics. I know they're odd. :P
SkinkLizzard
07-06-2009, 10:23 PM
gazza straight off it seems revive has a bug :)
cole got stuck half way while trying to revive marcus
also those drones are leet O_O I'm dying so sadly here :)
Gazza_N
07-06-2009, 10:31 PM
Thanks, Skink! Sorry 'bout that - a stupid collision problem that I thought I'd squashed. Fixed version in first post. Being able to revive should make things easier. ;)
Aequitas
07-06-2009, 10:38 PM
I managed to kill all the locust, and my team survived :D
Is there a health maximum? One of my guys went into cover and his health went to 55 (starting health is 50).
Now you just need to start adding specials. I had 1 locust left, and he just styed in cover for *ages*
Darth
07-06-2009, 10:54 PM
Sweetness !!!
Here some thoughts and ideas for you...
Gears combat is all about getting closer to your enemies (as you taught me with the shotgun over and over again back when it first came out :P).. so maybe have 3 layers of cover. 1 each side and one in the middle. When you start, all your characters are at the back, and you can use a action to move closer. When you are closer, the shotgun could do more damage, and if you are at the front cover and a locust is there, the chainsaw action becomes available, but it leaves you out of cover completely until your next turn.
Maybe make the characters feel a little different.. here are some examples:
Only Baird could have a sniper rifle, but no shotgun.
Dom could do 2x damage with the shotgun.
Marcus could move closer as a free action.
Cole could chainsaw and remain behind cover.
Also maybe make it that when an ally revives you they are vulnerable to damage until the next turn... as there seems no point in cover at the moment as it takes one turn to revive with no real penalty and the guy revives with full HP.
Also maybe make being in cover revive 10 HP.
Its looking really sweet though.. looking forward to some more gameplay!
Azimuth
08-06-2009, 01:43 AM
Maybe make the characters feel a little different.. here are some examples:
Only Baird could have a sniper rifle, but no shotgun.
Dom could do 2x damage with the shotgun.
Marcus could move closer as a free action.
Cole could chainsaw and remain behind cover.
While I'm not entirely convinced by those particular suggestions, the idea is a very good one.
Cloud_Ratha
08-06-2009, 02:42 AM
I thought azi would detest this project with every fibre of her being. Seeing as she loves gears, but hates jrpgs.
Food for thought :P
Gazza_N
08-06-2009, 07:46 AM
Is there a health maximum? One of my guys went into cover and his health went to 55 (starting health is 50).
Thanks. It shouldn't do that. :<
(as you taught me with the shotgun over and over again back when it first came out :P)
Have we played Gears together? I'm not GaZZa, if that's where the confusion comes in. ;)
Gears combat is all about getting closer to your enemies... so maybe have 3 layers of cover.
That's an interesting idea. It would require a slight reworking of how I'm doing things at the moment, but it might make things a little more tactical. I first want to see how my current implementation plays when it's complete, but this is a great way to spice things up if it turns out too static. Thanks! :D
EDIT: Actually, scratch that. I love this idea. I'll chop it down to two levels of cover, but it'll make things a lot more fun!
Maybe make the characters feel a little different..
Aaaaaah... But I haven't implemented character stats and levels yet, have I? ;)
In typical RPG style, each character will have a set of stats, used for damage calculations in combat and such. They will be:
ATTACK: A modifier that gets added to attack rolls. Determines how much damage the character does. Marcus will have a higher attack when the game starts.
ACCURACY: A modifier that makes a character far more likely to hit things, and even make hits behind cover at higher levels. Some weapons (Like the Longshot) will require decent accuracy to use effectively. Dom will have higher accuracy to start off with.
AGILITY: A modifier that increases maximum HP. Basically their ability to "dodge" and avoid damage, if you want to translate it back to the real game. Naturally, Cole will have initiative in this one, since he's a friggin tank. WOOOO!
APTITUDE: This stat determines the special attacks the character will be able to do, once that's up and running. Baird has this one cranked up a bit, being the tech of the team.
As you gain levels, you'll be able to increase each stat as you see fit, moulding the characters to suit your purposes better.
Also maybe make it that when an ally revives you they are vulnerable to damage until the next turn... as there seems no point in cover at the moment as it takes one turn to revive with no real penalty and the guy revives with full HP.
At the moment both the reviver and the "revivee" are out of cover (ie, vulnerable to damage) once it's done. I'm seriously considering having revived characters only revive to half (or even quarter) total health though, since it does feel a bit hax to revive to full health at the moment. As for +10HP heal per turn, that's a keeper, especially with that complaint Aeq had about the one Locust who stayed in cover for umpteen turns to heal.
I thought azi would detest this project with every fibre of her being. Seeing as she loves gears, but hates jrpgs.
I thought the same thing, and next thing I knew I had a set of pixel sprites to use. I guess the love for one overrides the hate for the other. ;)
Fengol
08-06-2009, 08:51 AM
I find the keys un-intuitive, please can you change them it to Enter and Escape. Also, rather than pressing X and accidently skipping a turn, will you add an option to the menu Skip or Wait?
Finally could you put in an initiative list on the top or on the side to show who's turn is next etc?
Gazza_N
08-06-2009, 10:06 AM
Is anyone else having problems with the controls? I was trying to emulate the SNES/GB-style A and B buttons, but if this is confusing to anyone then please say the word. Controls are easy to change. ;) I'm thinking Enter and Backspace as alternatives?
Irony is, I had an explicit "SKIP" option originally, but I cut it because the menu was getting cluttered. I have two options here - I can reinstate the menu option, or I can add a confirmation dialog when you hit the X/Backspace button ("Really Skip turn? Y/N"). Which do you fine folks think would be better?
The initiative list is a good idea for strategic purposes, but I worry because none of the other CRPGs I've ever played have had it. D&D doesn't make initiative obvious to anyone other than the DM either. It could be construed as an unfair advantage, a form of preCOGnition for the characters.
Fengol
08-06-2009, 10:59 AM
True, not all the games show initative, but just look at Pool of Radiance or Lost Odessey. I did find this article (pdf) you might find interesting XNA RPG – Battle System (http://xnafantasy.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/combat_n1.pdf) which has a JRPG style and includes formulas for Melee, Ranged, Magical combat and Turn resolution.
I know you want to copy the SNES emulator, but a for PC game Enter and Escape make more sense (especially to players who don't play SNES games). The problem with the "Really Skip" option is that it's just as affirmative as selecting a Skip option (i.e. The player must postively choose to skip) and now the user must hit 2 buttons to skip instead of just one.
Gazza_N
08-06-2009, 11:11 AM
Hmmm... I'll see your Pool of Radiance, and raise you "PreCOGnition", a Special ability which displays initiative for a turn. If you can "buy" it. :>
Point taken on the Skip command. Much smoother. I'll add it in. Also, I'm mapping Enter and Backspace as alternate (not replacement ;P) controls, because backspace is closer to Enter (and won't involve stretching over the keyboard), and because it has the "back" connotation. I still want Esc for game exit.
Fengol
08-06-2009, 11:18 AM
The problem with Precognition is that you lose the strategy part of combat. The initiative should be dynamic, based on a character stat and the previous action you took and level. You'll want to know when your sniper if going to get another shot off and if you should heal with the currect character because the enemy units will attack before your healer's turn comes up.
Gazza_N
08-06-2009, 11:26 AM
Thing is, although it's based on random shuffling rather than on an initiative roll, it's still cyclic. Do you know who's going to attack when in the real Gears? No. You can guess, but you never know. Gears RPG has an advantage over than in that, as you get into the battle, the attack order doesn't change. You observe the order and act accordingly. You take an initially chaotic situation, read the order in it, and base your strategy on those observations. That's what I'm trying to get across with this system - that random factor, that uncertainty that you have in a real Gears battle, but still in a way that can be read to a degree.
EDIT: I'll tell ya what. I'll show initiative above each character as a toggled display, for testing purposes. We'll judge it on what's more fun - strats based on known orders, or unknown order gradually uncovered by the player. ;)
Fengol
08-06-2009, 12:26 PM
Well, actually you DO know who's going to attack in the original game. Sniper Rifles and Bows take ages to reload so you have an opportunity to change cover, grenades take some time to explode and if you ask Aeq, he'll tell you that people watch you performing an execution because you're vunerable waiting for the animation to complete.
You can even look at this as an opportunity to enhance your game and give it more of that Gears of War feel by giving the player the Reload Bar and allowing him to tap for a quick reload after Firing. Normal reload will keep his place in the initiative queue, a perfect reload will push him up one and a failed reload will drop him 2.
Gazza_N
08-06-2009, 12:39 PM
I was going to use the Active Reload differently, but that's an interesting idea. I'll have to mull it over though - I'd need to completely rethink some portions of the game.
dislekcia
08-06-2009, 01:23 PM
I like the original mini-game active reload idea. Don't lose it just yet Gaz.
Nandrew
08-06-2009, 01:24 PM
Thing is, although it's based on random shuffling rather than on an initiative roll, it's still cyclic. Do you know who's going to attack when in the real Gears? No. You can guess, but you never know. Gears RPG has an advantage over than in that, as you get into the battle, the attack order doesn't change. You observe the order and act accordingly. You take an initially chaotic situation, read the order in it, and base your strategy on those observations. That's what I'm trying to get across with this system - that random factor, that uncertainty that you have in a real Gears battle, but still in a way that can be read to a degree.
EDIT: I'll tell ya what. I'll show initiative above each character as a toggled display, for testing purposes. We'll judge it on what's more fun - strats based on known orders, or unknown order gradually uncovered by the player. ;)
I like the idea of players figuring out that sort of rhythm for themselves. It means that an experienced player actually gets *better* because they've worked out the system. Beginners are ... well, beginners, and they'll have a tougher time because they don't know all the rules yet. So you'll give them fewer enemies or whatnot to deal with.
Nothing in a game satisfies me more than realising that after a while of playing, I'm able to take on a larger group of enemies with the same stats/characters because I'VE improved rather than the CHARACTERS simply getting better. ;)
... though of course, that doesn't have anything to do with randomised initiative at the beginning of each combat. Gah.
... oh, hey, also: fun proto!
Kensei
09-06-2009, 04:27 PM
Umm, there was something weird going on with the health of the locusts in my game - perhaps it was my wide screen or something but the health meters were drawn a lot more SE than they should have been.
On the topic of the 'skip' button, is there a reason why you could not just put 'Skip/Wait' option in the battle menu?
Other than that, er, good prototype
Gazza_N
09-06-2009, 09:43 PM
Thanks to everyone who pointed out the numerous bugs, niggles, control hassles, crashes, misplaced graphics, collision problems and other silly mistakes of mine. Rest assured they've either been fixed, or are being worked on. It's been a very productive prototype in terms of feedback, that's for sure. That's what happens when you try to adapt a game that so many people love. ;)
First major change so far has been to switch to mouse control. People were having far too many hassles with my NES-style controls so, by popular demand, it's all mouse-driven from here on out. I've rebalanced weapons too, fine-tuning my damage calcs. I've also nerfed Revive to restore fewer HP, to add a bit more of a challenge. I'm holding back on the multilayered cover for now - I want to get the core dynamic running first. Regeneration rate is up to 10HP per turn too, which is much nicer.
Current work includes the implementation of the special attack system, along with the Active Reload-themed minigame that ties into it. The premise is this: Every few shots a character makes (the actual number dependent on the weapon they're using, and progress to next reload on the status bar), the active reload bar appears. A perfect AR nets that character a 20% damage bonus for the next turn, as well as a Special Point. A successful AR gives you a slightly lower damage bonus without the Special Point. A failed AR subtracts a Special Point.
Special Points are piled up in a global shared "account", capped at a maximum that I haven't determined yet. When a character wants to use a special ability, they spend Special Points to activate it, which are deducted from this amount.
I'm seeing if this works well or not, but I think it feels good so far. You can expect a (hopefully) much-improved release a little later this week.
Gazza_N
14-06-2009, 04:43 PM
A brand new build of Gears of War RPG is new, improved, and ready for download! I've added so many new ossum stuffs that it would take me forever to list 'em here, so just pull it down from the link in the first post and let your eyes (and ears ^_^) be the judge.
Also, please, please, PLEASE press F1 to view the help. The mechanics have changed considerably since the last version, and reading the help... er... helps. A lot.
EDIT: Slightly updated version uploaded that fixes an annoying bug where not triggering during Active Reload would freeze the game.
Nandrew
14-06-2009, 11:04 PM
Oh wow, did you create that midi track? ^_^
I like how this is developing. One thing I've realised, however, is that for game balance purposes it may be a good idea to attach a small SP cost to revival: right now, it seems to be more efficient to let a player be downed and be recovered to full health (potential miss of 2 turns from your squad) than it would be for a player near death to hide in cover for a few turns.
Gazza_N
15-06-2009, 07:22 AM
Yeah, I've been messing around a bit with some freeware sequencing software I got a while back. Given the genre, it seemed essential that it have some sort of battle music. :P
Revive is proving to be a tricky thing to get right without totally unbalancing the game. For now, I've tried implemented a system that's similar to the 3-strike rule in Gears multiplayer, limiting the number of times each player can be revived. I've also dropped player base health and buffed the enemies a bit, and given that I'm actually getting slaughtered by my own game now, it seems to be working. :P
Nandrew
15-06-2009, 11:12 AM
Hah, just don't get too ambitious with cranking up the difficulty! Remember that if you're going to struggle, your players are probably going to have a much worse time of it. :P
That and, let's not lie, the core of any self-respecting JRPG is ludicrously easy and highly repetitive combat! \:D/
Darth
15-06-2009, 07:37 PM
2 things.. I broke your system.. I can get 20 super points or whatever they called easily... but you haven't finished coding!!!
Only the grenade and chainsaw special attacks work.. the last 2 don't...
Gazza_N
15-06-2009, 07:59 PM
2 things.. I broke your system.. I can get 20 super points or whatever they called easily... but you haven't finished coding!!!
Only the grenade and chainsaw special attacks work.. the last 2 don't...
Oh, nicely done! Nobody else seems to have noticed the "mash spacebar to get SP" Active Reload 'sploit. Already fixed that one, but thanks for pointing it out! ;)
As for the last two superweapons, they haven't been coded yet. Expect them in the next release!
Chippit
15-06-2009, 08:01 PM
Only the grenade and chainsaw special attacks work.. the last 2 don't...
The help file clearly states this is the case. :P The game's not done yet after all.
Darth
16-06-2009, 09:34 AM
The help file clearly states this is the case. :P The game's not done yet after all.
Reading is for people with more time on their hands...
How do you expect me to read when i'm playing Peggle????
Sorry... *sits in the corner.*
SkinkLizzard
18-06-2009, 04:03 PM
Hey gazza whats the name of this freeware sequencing software?
I've been trying to use a tracker and then convert to mp3, its somewhat of a hassle.
Gazza_N
27-06-2009, 11:09 PM
http://i261.photobucket.com/albums/ii48/Gazza_N/Title.png
Prepare yourselves.
(I have another artist now to supplement Azi's stuff, BTW. ^____^)
Hey gazza whats the name of this freeware sequencing software?
I've been trying to use a tracker and then convert to mp3, its somewhat of a hassle.
It's called Jazz++ (http://jazzplusplus.sourceforge.net/). Not always the most user-friendly software in the world, but it gets the job done.
Azimuth
28-06-2009, 12:22 AM
The title screen is ossim, but the fonts should really be run through a pixel filter for consistency. Right now it jars a little with the Crimson Omen.
dislekcia
28-06-2009, 01:32 AM
The title screen is ossim, but the fonts should really be run through a pixel filter for consistency. Right now it jars a little with the Crimson Omen.
QFT! Pixel that **** up, yo :)
Also, Gaz's mutant naming ability strikes again.
Azimuth
28-06-2009, 01:51 AM
Actually, the "Super Gear of War Adventure" part was mine. ^___^
zakeroph
28-06-2009, 09:13 AM
<_<
>_>
i dont know if someone already noticed this but when i finished off the sniper with a chainsaw the game refused to tell me i won, i know the chainsaw is kinda a nub way to win but come on!
yea i killed all except the sniper then finished him off with teh chainsaw and now no more locusts want to respawn out of fear of death.
Gazza_N
28-06-2009, 10:40 AM
The title screen is ossim, but the fonts should really be run through a pixel filter for consistency. Right now it jars a little with the Crimson Omen.
I'd already raised the pixellation issue with my sister before I posted. She needs to thicken the lines up first, though, otherwise the filter blurs it into an unreadable mess. Still, as trailer art, it gets the job done. ;)
Actually, the "Super Gear of War Adventure" part was mine. ^___^
Yeah, Azi gets joint naming credit for this one. Her vitriol for JRPGs is very handy at times. ;)
i dont know if someone already noticed this but when i finished off the sniper with a chainsaw the game refused to tell me i won, i know the chainsaw is kinda a nub way to win but come on!
Heh, fixed this little niggle last week, thanks. ;) Also, the chainsaw is *not* a nub way to win. It is an awesome way to win. Especially now that the Locust gib spectacularly when chainsawed. :P
Azimuth
28-06-2009, 12:39 PM
http://s138.photobucket.com/albums/q258/azimuth666/Title-3.png
Just run it through a mosaic filter. :P
Gazza_N
28-06-2009, 01:48 PM
I don't pay you enough.
Sir PaniCore
28-06-2009, 04:38 PM
This looks awesome took the 2 greatest things on earth and combined them....
Gazza_N
30-06-2009, 09:08 PM
Well, I'm off on some emergency business trip thing tomorrow, so I have no choice but to post what I have so far as my final entry. Link in the first post. It's not properly balanced, it may still have some bugs, and it's missing some sound effects. I wish I could've done Gears more justice with this game, but you'll just have to suffer through it and try to have what fun you can. Game instructions are in the readme, as per comp requirements.
A special word of thanks to Azimuth and my sister Sismrnoth for their help with the art. While the game may not be so great, the art really shines. I can heartily recommend their services to anyone who needs help with game art in the future (given, of course, that they're willing to provide it :P).
Good luck to all the other entrants! I'm looking forward to playing all your stuff when I get back! ^_^
dislekcia
01-07-2009, 01:25 AM
You and your emergency business trips... Will we be able to expect a Gaz-presence before next week?
Sismrnoth
01-07-2009, 09:42 AM
A small issue:
Try to avoid reviving a character who was charging the Torque bow when he 'died'. It may freeze the game, and I'm sure that nobody really wants that. ;)
Gazza_N
02-07-2009, 08:47 AM
You and your emergency business trips... Will we be able to expect a Gaz-presence before next week?
Indeed you can. I'm back a day earlier than expected, and I'm going to upload a fixed version tonight that hopefully eliminates the nastier bugs (like the one Sis mentioned above. She's been diligently bug-hunting while I was away). Even if it's too late for comp entry, I still want people to be able to play a game that WORKS.
Azimuth
02-07-2009, 01:30 PM
Oh, a suggestion - wouldn't it be better if everyone started out with one revive?
Gazza_N
02-07-2009, 01:38 PM
They did. Then I got complaints that this made the game too easy. :P
I'd like to request that all non-judge people try to hold off from playing the game until I post my fixed version tonight. There are some real showstopper bugs that've sneaked in, I've been told/ have found to my dismay.
Sismrnoth
02-07-2009, 01:40 PM
Yeah, I started it up today and the WHOLE COMPUTAR EGMSPLODED!!!
Sorry Gaz. It was your computer.
Gazza_N
02-07-2009, 02:26 PM
Oy. That Torque Bow bug is important, Ms. Funnypants. As is the one where you can't get to the endgame. Fewer accusations of hyperbole, more fixing of dodgy tiles plzkthx. :<
EDIT: Also, I hereby resolve to keep tongue-in-cheek sibling bickering out of the thread from this point forward. ;P
Sismrnoth
02-07-2009, 02:35 PM
Yay buck passing FTW.
Tiling has been fixed. :P
Playing well, but leveling bug is still an issue. Level 6. Works with hax but not with legit XP gaining. is strangely fixed by using hax battle win level up or COG tag level up...
Chippit
02-07-2009, 06:27 PM
Oy. That Torque Bow bug is important, Ms. Funnypants. As is the one where you can't get to the endgame. Fewer accusations of hyperbole, more fixing of dodgy tiles plzkthx. :<
EDIT: Also, I hereby resolve to keep tongue-in-cheek sibling bickering out of the thread from this point forward. ;P
Nono, keep it here, it's endlessly amusing. As well as familiar. *muches popcorn*
Gazza_N
02-07-2009, 10:10 PM
Alright. Totally final real final uploaded - debugged, tested, balanced, tweaked. Link in first post, and I can truthfully say that I'm really proud of this version. :)
I don't want to see another line of code for the next month. :<<<
Fengol
03-07-2009, 09:21 AM
I don't want to see another line of code for the next month.
And then the next comp starts :P
Gazza_N
03-07-2009, 11:06 AM
Judging? Pffffft. It's common knowledge that the month off exists to let entrants regain sleep and sanity. :P
Also, I've been advised of a tiny bug where the Kantus corpse in the boss battle loops through his walking animations. I officially declare here and now that he is most definitely dead, but spinning in his grave. No zombie Kanti/Kantuseseseseses in this game. No way.
dammit
03-07-2009, 02:37 PM
This is awesome :)
DukeOFprunes
08-07-2009, 10:20 AM
I am hatin on yall for making the coolest little RPG ever, playas. Hatin hatin hatin. Feel my rays of hate-itude.
Gazza_N
08-07-2009, 11:26 AM
NOOOOOO! Not the rays of hate-itude! D:
Thanks to all who've given feedback, either here or on IRC/GTalk. Consensus seems to be that it doesn't melt the brains of whoever plays it. This is unfortunate. I'll need to find another tricksy way to kill everyone on the planet. :<
Planning to work my way through the other PC-based entries as soon as I can.
Shadow_Con
23-07-2009, 03:36 PM
Mwahahaha. Love the ending
dislekcia
23-07-2009, 05:49 PM
The ending was awesome :)
Bonezmann
02-08-2009, 02:02 PM
Wow, this is an excellent little game. There goes my sunday afternoon... We should mention it in Kensei's "Indie game" thread if someone hason't already done so?
Gazza_N
03-08-2009, 09:26 AM
Heh. The game's still a bit too rough around the edges for that, methinks. I do appreciate the sentiment though. ^______^
That said, I'm becoming more and more strongly tempted to expand on the mechanics in this game to make something using my own setting and characters. Foremost on my mind is making the combat a bit more dynamic, as opposed to the very static system I have here. It's an oldskool JRPG system, yes, but because of that it gets very repetitive, especially given all the combat I force the player into. More sidequests and proper puzzles would've reduced my reliance on combat to keep the player occupied, admittedly. I'm also rather upset that I didn't get a chance to implement Darth's suggestion on character position/effectiveness tradeoff before deadline, because it was a fantastic idea that would've opened up more weapon choices for the player (the shotgun and Boomshot would've relied on this concept), and made combat more strategic.
The SP idea definitely needs to be expanded on. I'm very happy with how it worked out, and I think its role can be increased. A Septerra Core-style multitier attack system comes to mind immediately.
In the words of Eddie Izzard: "So.... Yeah." :P
Shadow_Con
03-08-2009, 12:39 PM
I found that if you dont click to active reload then it jams the ammo bar and you cant get any more points from that characters reloads
Gazza_N
03-08-2009, 12:45 PM
AHA! Thanks! I've heard of this bug, and I've been struggling to pinpoint the cause. Are you certain that it only occurs if you don't trigger the reload at all?
Karuji
07-08-2009, 08:28 PM
Gaz I've also had the bug of not triggering the reload and thus could not do anymore reloading due to points being full and such.
Oh and awesome game ^_^
dammit
08-08-2009, 09:54 AM
Gaz I've also had the bug of not triggering the reload and thus could not do anymore reloading due to points being full and such.
Oh and awesome game ^_^
I must admit, I didn't reload at one point and I haven't had this problem...
Cloud_Ratha
08-08-2009, 06:59 PM
Yay. Now please don't sue us.
Awesome! Finally gonna put this jem to the test!
Gazza_N
08-08-2009, 11:09 PM
As happy as I am that folks are enjoying the game, I still value any and all critique that you guys may have. It's still far from perfect - tell me how to make it better! :D
Nandrew
09-08-2009, 09:34 AM
Okie dokes, here's some stuff:
(1) If you're going for the polish, I'd like to see a greater variety of weapons, and a greater variation of their effects (aside from raw damage). For example, a snub pistol could do less damage, but require reloading more often, making it a tactical SP mill rather than a pure "hit 'em hard"-er. Or maybe have a weapon which does little damage, but becomes devastating with a perfect reload (kinda like how the boltok actually is). Not only that, but it would make opponents generally more interesting to fight against if you had more weapons to introduce earlier: then it's a case of "oh crap, they have a Gnasher and a Sniper, which one do I need to take out first?"
(2) Your current combat progress (at least for the first part of the game) seems to follow the lines of "start with fewer enemies, then get more enemies to up the challenge for the player". I suggest that you perhaps consider upping the ante with enemies that aren't necessarily tougher, but do more damage instead. This will shorten the combat situations that you have. 'Cos while I'm not much of a JRPG fan, I have played a few and on average, your "random encounter" battles are a bit longer than the typical JRPG conflict.
So yeah, consider throwing more "glass cannons" into your opponent lineup: the sort that you can take down quickly, but who will be a massive pain in the ass if they're allowed to snap off too many shots.
(3) You mentioned more "cutscenes", dialog and sidequests at one point. This would be nice, yeah, and I'll let you decide how best to implement that. :P
That's what I can think of for now, I'll try get more suggestions further down the line.
Gazza_N
09-08-2009, 09:21 PM
All valid points. Thanks Nandrew.
Firstly, I agree that more weapons are pretty much essential to making combat more dynamic. I'm happy with the way the existing three weapons work, but I agree that expanding the arsenal will require unique traits for the new weapons to make them worth equipping.
One thing that springs immediately to mind is having a unique Special Attack based on the weapon a character has equipped (I think the current one-weapon-per-character system works pretty well. Agreed?). For the moment, you can use the Lancer's Chainsaw as a Special Attack regardless of what weapon is equipped, for the low, low price of 10SP. What if, for instance, you had the Torque Bow equipped, and the Chainsaw ability were replaced with a "Certain Kill" perk that ignored an accuracy roll, or added splash damage to the final explosion? For the shotgun (which I'm thinking of having deal small amounts of damage to a spread of enemies), why not have a close range "Splatter", where the character moves in close for an instakill (or a large amount of damage) on a single enemy?
A wider range of enemies would work well too, especially for the "glass cannon" you suggested. In this, I think adding Wretches would work, as well as the dreaded Boomer, neither of which would have the benefit of cover. The Kantus, which I had as a boss in the Comp version, could make a good opponent in regular battles too (nerfed accordingly).
AI needs to be smarter too. For now, they just select a non-downed target and fire. It's perfectly possible to have them gauge threats according to cover, equipped weapon, etc, even if I just weight their targeting roll slightly to increase the odds of a given target being selected. I'd have to try this out, just to make sure that they don't hax too much. ;)
I'd already mentioned how I had to forego sidequests and more complex puzzles due to time constraints (Those cages you guys saw in the Hollow levels? Not originally for simple decoration). Time to slap those in, methinks.
Nandrew
09-08-2009, 10:18 PM
Hokay, lessa looka atta dees.
Firstly, your point on AI stands out. It would be lovely to make your opponents smarter, but I'm going to say not to make it a PRIORITY. In other words, if there's something else better that you think you should be working on, do that instead. I've seen JRPGs which have balefully simple opponent AI which still manage to make fights interesting and rewarding.
Actually, in general, the mark of a truly good game coder is creating a fun and versatile system with limited AI: this is in the same vein as a good designer creating a deep game with relatively few core rules.
Adding Wretches, Boomers and other enemies with no cover is a great idea. Your cover system is currently very fun to use and offers depth that I admire: on the flipside, however, it is the greatest slowing factor in your combat, and addressing that con is very important for a good battle system. tl;dr version: your cover system offers tactical depth at the cost of tempo. There was a gamasutra article on this somewhere, I wish I could find it.
I like the "one special attack per weapon" idea too. Just don't let it overwhelm you or the game system: less is more, so you have to decide whether or not it'll truly be a credit to your game, or if you can get by on just having a greater variety of weapons.
And again: I'm reserving comment on the sidequests, et cetera for now. I wanna see what you come up with first, then we can tear it apart. Your game is reaching that rare level where we can start poking at things more severely, and more nittily. :P
----
Oh, and I think I should mention randomly that you must tweak with your stats system as little as possible from here on. It really strikes me as quite watertight and well-balanced as it is. Try not to add any bells or whistles.
Nandrew
09-08-2009, 10:23 PM
Aha! With regards to your cover system, read these:
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/4024/examining_game_pace_how_.php
http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/AdamSaltsman/20090513/1367/Doomed_to_Invent_Our_Mistakes.php
They both have points which brush against your current gameplay. Decide whether or not you agree with them, but consider them carefully either way: again, your goal is to try maximise the advantage that cover offers to your gameplay, while minimising the weaknesses that it opens up.
I know I'm going on about this particular point, but cover really is quite important in your game, and is the factor that's separating your title from most other RPGs. It also happens to be the feature that made me pick up your game in the first place.
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