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Bonezmann
05-08-2008, 01:04 PM
The name may change. Im doing this from my phone so sory for any grammar mistakes. Right, as soon as i saw the rules i saw the patapon concept in a way. My game, ancient history will travel back in time to where people used hiroglyphs and drawings to comunicate, from incan times to our very own khoi khoi and san races, ancient history will take you there. . . Oh and ill use gm7pro

UPDATE

Ancient history - San v0.5 (http://www.gamedev.za.net/filecloset/data/files/560/ahc.zip)

See last post for problems and Bugs :)

UPDATE

Here's a quick Egypt demo/Prototype:

Egypt Prototype (http://www.gamedev.za.net/filecloset/data/files/563/ahe.zip)

(There is no save function in the Egypt level yet as I have not yet merged it with the main

project.)

The symbols on the blocks have NO meaning in the game, they are actual ancient Egyptian

glyphs, they just don't mean anything here.

The controls are once again explained, you just need to figure out what the formations of

glyphs mean.

Remember that this is a quite early version of the Egyptian level.

PROBLEMS

The scarab can move off the screen

I still need to tweak the speed and movement of the symbol blocks on the path

I need to add the timing desabling the shots and/or the respawn of the symbol blocks the

scarab shoots

-------------

As for the San, I'm reconstructing the level a bit, so you transfer to a new room containing the boss. :)

Bonezmann
05-08-2008, 01:05 PM
As always any questions and comments are welcome

dislekcia
05-08-2008, 01:23 PM
Fixed the name for you ;)

Kensei
05-08-2008, 01:27 PM
Sounds interesting. Will it be a sort of puzzle game, where you have a challenge/response kind of mechanic? So it's either matching the two images or a rock/paper/scissors thing.

Bonezmann
05-08-2008, 01:38 PM
the whole game will hapen on a wall, thus using hieroglyphs to do everything from playing the game to explaining controls. There will be some desyphering involved when the controls are explained so it wont be explained straight forward. Was there something wrong with my thread title?

dislekcia
05-08-2008, 02:21 PM
the whole game will hapen on a wall, thus using hieroglyphs to do everything from playing the game to explaining controls. There will be some desyphering involved when the controls are explained so it wont be explained straight forward. Was there something wrong with my thread title?

You had comp 19 instead of 20.

Also, you can't give players coded text. That's the same as text. Even if they have to decipher that (hippo)(eagle)(snake)(snake)(pyramid) = H E L L O, that's still text and therefor not allowed.

I want people to think up other ways to get things across to players.

Bonezmann
05-08-2008, 02:34 PM
It wont be like what you explained, i understand completely how it works. I can assure you there wont be text, hieroglyphs wich is pictures, but no text.

ShadowMaster
05-08-2008, 02:38 PM
ok while we are on the topic, pictures depicting actions is fine, but say for instance representing "boot camp" with a boot and a camp is not?

Bonezmann
05-08-2008, 07:29 PM
San_proto (http://www.cononiah.com/san_proto.rar) ~1mb

The San prototype, you can move and shoot animals, that's all I'm saying. Enjoy! :)

I don't know how much I'll be on the internet for now, but I'll still go on as often as I can. Any Questions and comments are welcome. :)

dINGLE
05-08-2008, 08:42 PM
Played it.

LOL @ the animation, its not bad, just funny.

The keys and game play seems pretty intuitive, although maybe if I didn't read about running and shooting animals I would have been a bit confused.

Maybe if you are given an example of some san running after animals first, or you waited for the player to move to the right before making the animals start running, then it would be a bit more clear.

ShadowMaster
05-08-2008, 09:16 PM
Maybe if you are given an example of some san running after animals first, or you waited for the player to move to the right before making the animals start running, then it would be a bit more clear.

Exactly the point of this competition: Inspire player to do what you want without explicitly telling him. ;)

Thaumaturge
06-08-2008, 12:18 AM
Hmm... Interesting.

One thing that I'm not clear on is what sort of game do you intend to make - is it intended to teach, or just as a fun jaunt through ancient-world-themed levels?

As to gameplay, is it entirely a run-and-shoot game, is that only the case in the Koi-san section, or is that to be expanded on as well?

I'm trying to get a better impression of what you intend the game to be like, you see. ^_^

As for the prototype, it's reasonably fun as far as it goes, and does have an ancient-culture-illustration feel to it. Once you get to that point, it might be improved by styling the graphics of this section after a rock painting - controlling characters in a living rock painting, with similar levels for the other cultures, such as controlling figures on Ancient Egyptian tomb walls, sounds as though it could produce a really effective and enjoyable aesthetic. ^_^

Bonezmann
09-08-2008, 12:40 PM
[Tiny text update]

I'm at an internet caf? right now and forgot the game at home, but here's a little text update from what changed since the first release:

Changed graphics

savegame system

rewards system

I don't think it's enough to post an update right now anyways, so I'll post the next version next Saturday, hopefully with a new ancient race. :)

Thaumaturge
09-08-2008, 07:03 PM
I look forward to seeing those changes, Bonezmann. ^_^

Kensei
09-08-2008, 11:53 PM
Can I make little niggle comments?

You might want to implement a collision checking of sorts, I ws able to move all the people off the screen AND still run left and right screen.
I appreciate the ability to turn around but don't forget to implement a way to fire the other way as well if this is what you want the player to be able to do.

Still good and basic prototype :)

Bonezmann
10-08-2008, 12:44 AM
Im glad to hear that thaumaturge. :) thanx for the comments kensei , the problems you mentioned will be fixed in the next version. :)

Bonezmann
18-08-2008, 01:42 PM
It sucks not being able to upload games, i may or may not upload the newer san version tonight. The san is 99% complete and im working on the egyptians now. . .

Bonezmann
20-08-2008, 09:13 PM
FINALLY! I got the free version to upload, waited about 45 minutes for a 4.5mb file to upload. wonderful...

Anyways here it is:

Ancient History - San v0.5 (http://www.gamedev.za.net/filecloset/data/files/560/ahc.zip)

I forgot to fix the mentioned problems, my internet isn't what I'm used to but I assure you it will be fixed next time ;)

Problems/Bugs

The San can still move off-screen
The spears still go the wrong way when running left
The San can't die yet
Still needs some sound effects.

I hope you enjoy it and, as always, all comments and questions are appreciated. The problems mentioned will be fixed in the next version.

One question though (and I'll ask this in the Comp thread too): Is the explicit show of control pictures allowed? Or should I do something else?

Thaumaturge
20-08-2008, 09:42 PM
I like the menus, from what I've seen of them, although it took me a moment (albeit perhaps as a result of lack of sleep) to realise the meaning of the first two icons, and I while I discovered the meaning of the sun icon I'm not sure of how it relates to that meaning.

More importantly I imagine, however, I haven't managed to get into the San section of the game yet - clicking on what seems to be the appropriate icon doesn't seem to yield any results, and nor do any of the keys that I've tried. :/

Again, I'm pretty tired, so I may just be missing something...

[edit] As to explicitly displaying controls, I don't know whether it's allowed (although I would imagine that it is, as long as you don't use text, speech or something similar), but if you do wish to follow that route, may I suggest finding a way to integrate it into the setting - such as using San-like symbolic images, or Egyptian hieroglyphs. This could be especially effective, I think, if you manage to find a way to represent the relevant ideas effectively without using the more obvious symbols, such as San arrows for the arrow keys.

Bonezmann
21-08-2008, 07:53 AM
More importantly I imagine, however, I haven't managed to get into the San section of the game yet - clicking on what seems to be the appropriate icon doesn't seem to yield any results, and nor do any of the keys that I've tried. :/

Explore my dear forumite, explore. ;) If you're refering to the empty page, that's not it. I think that once I add the music and sounds, it'll be much clearer.


may I suggest finding a way to integrate it into the setting - such as using San-like symbolic images, or Egyptian hieroglyphs.

You just read my mind there. ;)

Thaumaturge
21-08-2008, 08:49 AM
Explore my dear forumite, explore. If you're refering to the empty page, that's not it. I think that once I add the music and sounds, it'll be much clearer.


Aah, I seem to have found it. ^_^

It might have helped, I suppose, if you'd activated the right part of the world for the San (at least, based on what knowledge I have of them)... :P

First of all I like the progress that you've made on this game, and the direction in which you're going thus far. ^_^

I'll probably give you my impressions of the game itself later today, but for now I have a few more comments...

Other than the geographical issue, I think obstacles to my finding the game remained in that the map doesn't look "active" to me (it looks to me like a backdrop, with the other icons appearing as the "active" portions). Since the sun icon produced what appeared to be buttons, one of which appeared to be related to your San section, I got the impression that those were used to access the game. I recommend having the relevant parts of the world stand out before being hovered over, perhaps by separating them from the background (possibly including enlarging them) and placing a little border around them, perhaps using a backing light or shadow effect.

What purpose is served by the icons that appear after clicking on the sun? If they're meant to be progress indicators, or something similarly representational, instead of interactive, then I suggest removing the bevel and making it clearer that they are intended to show something. For example, if they were intended to be filling progress indicators, you might make them longer in one direction than the other, and have their zero-point be a little ahead of the zero-end, with a little bar fill between to indicate their purpose. Otherwise, you might add an appropriate descriptive icon or background.

Finally, why do the controls only seem to be given only after I've completed the San section?

Bonezmann
21-08-2008, 01:33 PM
Oh, i forgot to mention that. Just ignore the control buttons after completing the san level. They serve as a place holder for the next level once it has been unlocked. As for the icons shown after clicking the sun, its the reward system and the spear reward is active. You just need to figure out how to get it. Im going to change some graphics like you mentioned tonight. The sun was actually supposed to be the incan calender stone, needless to say it doesnt look like it at all. I just got some ideas for the icons and map, i think itll solve the problem. ;)

Thaumaturge
21-08-2008, 08:15 PM
Aah, fair enough.


I just got some ideas for the icons and map, i think itll solve the problem. ;)

I'm glad to hear it. ^_^

As to the game itself, the changes that you've made thus far seem good. I particularly like your introductory and ending sequences. ^_^

The rhinoceros (I presume that it is) seems die awfully easily, however. :P

If I may suggest, I think that it would add to the game to have the animals leave carcasses when killed, rather than vanishing.

By the way, what purpose, of any, does the first pink box (near the top of the screen, not far into the level) serve?

Finally, although it's probably something that you should defer until more important matters are taken care of, I think that it might be a good idea to lower the degree or apparent "roughness" in the rock effect - at the moment the degree of the effect results in it producing a little too much noise, I think.

Kensei
21-08-2008, 09:46 PM
I am with Thaum, the menu system is a bit confusing :(

I love the intro and completion pictures, they are very good. Can you make the speed of the men moving faster... I liked the idea of speed in the first version and it seems that it has been lost in the latest version.



The rhinoceros (I presume that it is) seems die awfully easily, however. :P


Die?

Erm, I just avoided it :)

Thaumaturge
21-08-2008, 09:56 PM
Die?

Erm, I just avoided it :)

Coward. :P

(Of course, this is coming from someone whose preferred method of combat is "zap them from outside of their attack range". ;))

Bonezmann
21-08-2008, 10:12 PM
I am with Thaum, the menu system is a bit confusing

I assure you the new icons will be more explanatory, the empty page also didn't fit the game very well ;)


Can you make the speed of the men moving faster... I liked the idea of speed in the first version and it seems that it has been lost in the latest version.


Sure, will do that. I didn't even notice they were slower :)


As to the game itself, the changes that you've made thus far seem good. I particularly like your introductory and ending sequences. ^_^



love the intro and completion pictures, they are very good

I'm glad to hear you like it:D


The rhinoceros (I presume that it is) seems die awfully easily, however. :P


You're correct, it's a rhino and it dies easily. I'm still thinking about how exactly I'm going to implement the boss thing.


If I may suggest, I think that it would add to the game to have the animals leave carcasses when killed, rather than vanishing.


This could add some humour, the ideas are flushing in...


By the way, what purpose, of any, does the first pink box (near the top of the screen, not far into the level) serve?


That's supposed to be the "Explicit showing of the controls" I mentioned earlier. Apparently, I didn't put in the arrows... :(


Finally, although it's probably something that you should defer until more important matters are taken care of, I think that it might be a good idea to lower the degree or apparent "roughness" in the rock effect - at the moment the degree of the effect results in it producing a little too much noise, I think.

I must say, I agree with you. It can sometimes be a little hard to see with all that noise...


Die?

Erm, I just avoided it

You won't be so lucky in the next version :)

On a side note, I am sad to say that I won't be able to give much comment on the other projects. I'm suddenly without internet, and I went on a limb and bought a 150mb bundle from vodacom (GPRS) wich has to last a month at least. But I will download and comment as soon as I can gt my busy bum to an internet cafe where I can download. :)

Bonezmann
24-08-2008, 10:04 PM
UPDATE

Here's a quick Egypt demo/Prototype:

Egypt Prototype (http://www.gamedev.za.net/filecloset/data/files/563/ahe.zip)

(There is no save function in the Egypt level yet as I have not yet merged it with the main project.)

The symbols on the blocks have NO meaning in the game, they are actual ancient Egyptian glyphs, they just don't mean anything here.

The controls are once again explained, you just need to figure out what the formations of glyphs mean.

Remember that this is a quite early version of the Egyptian level.

PROBLEMS

The scarab can move off the screen

I still need to tweak the speed and movement of the symbol blocks on the path

I need to add the timing disabling the shots and/or the respawn of the symbol blocks the scarab shoots

-------------

As for the San, I'm reconstructing the level a bit, so you transfer to a new room containing the boss. :)

All Questions, suggestions and comments are welcome :)

Thaumaturge
25-08-2008, 01:42 AM
Hmm... It's a decent start, but I'm not sure of how it fits into the Egyptian theme, I'm afraid, aside from the pyramid in the centre. The San game (at least, as of the last version) tied nicely into the rock paintings and an activity that I imagine would have been a major part of San life. In this case the connection seems more tenuous to me.

However, with some fairly minor thematic changes I think that this could well work. For example, you might change the blocks to pyramid construction blocks being drawn by labourers.

Perhaps better yet, you might have them be attacking armies, each under the auspices of a particular Ancient Egyptian god; the player would then be tasked with despatching priests of that god to turn back the invaders, or cast spells from that god, or, for greater difficulty, implement an "opposing gods" or "deity rock-paper-scissors" setup (Horus beats Set, Set beats Osiris, etc.).

You might even, if you want to increase the difficulty further, include armies that will not turn back - I would recommend Set or, perhaps better yet, Apep (Apophis) for their patron.

As to the gameplay itself, it works, I believe; the only problem that I see that you haven't mentioned (if I'm interpreting the last problem that you mentioned correctly to refer to controlling the player's fire rate) is that the number of "hits" that the player can take (i.e. blocks that can be let through) doesn't seem to be immediately clear, without (presumably) counting the number of blocks that get past during play.

Finally, in terms of controls, I see two problems:

First, the key representation looks just like the other boxes present elsewhere on the screen, which I think left me with the impression that it was a readout of some sort, rather than a picture of a key.

Second, the layout of the block symbols resembles that of the arrow keys.

I thus started off attempting to use the arrow keys, at first alone (I think), and later together with the correct key, until I realised that they weren't used at all.

I would suggest filling the key representation with a colour, and arranging the block images in a different conformation - a line, perhaps, or a square layout.

Bonezmann
25-08-2008, 07:12 AM
I must admit, I'm stuck at the Egyptians. I don't know what to do, even after a whole weekend of watching as much egyptian programs on the History channel, searching the net and searching britannica.

I played this game on my phone called "Zum Zum" or something. It's similar to this, but with the coloured balls like Zuma(PC). That's what gave me this idea.

Believe me I've thought about mummification levels right through to mural god-battles, it just didn't seem to work, the level I uploaded doesn't seem to work as well.


First, the key representation looks just like the other boxes present elsewhere on the screen, which I think left me with the impression that it was a readout of some sort, rather than a picture of a key.


That's kinda the whole point, you have to "Decypher" it. ;)

Thanx for the comments and suggestions, I'll look into them and hopefully make a better game. :)

dislekcia
25-08-2008, 01:10 PM
You could give the key block a shadow. That would indicate that it can be interacted with...

Thaumaturge
26-08-2008, 02:08 AM
I must admit, I'm stuck at the Egyptians. I don't know what to do, even after a whole weekend of watching as much egyptian programs on the History channel, searching the net and searching britannica.

I played this game on my phone called "Zum Zum" or something. It's similar to this, but with the coloured balls like Zuma(PC). That's what gave me this idea.

Believe me I've thought about mummification levels right through to mural god-battles, it just didn't seem to work, the level I uploaded doesn't seem to work as well.

I'm sorry to hear that you've had so much trouble. :/

As I said, I think that the level that you have now could work with some thematic changes (and little by way of gameplay changes) - making the "blocks" invading armies, for example, and changing the background to represent a highway just outside the player's city.

Heh, a mummification level might be oddly unpleasant to watch for such a game as this appears to be thus far. :P

("Squicky (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Squick)", in TV Tropes terms. Be careful in reading that page. ^^; )

As for another idea, you might have the player play as a shabti (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabti), serving the pharoah and fending off treasure-hunters. The gameplay might be either platformer (which should build nicely on the San level) or top-down, and involve a mix of "errands" for the pharoah (getting items from bodies, fetching food, asking something of another mummy, etc.) and fighting against graverobbers. The playe can lose by either taking too long in an "errand", in which case the pharoah revokes his life, or by being destroyed by an adventurer.


That would indicate that it can be interacted with...

It can be interacted with? o_0

Kensei
26-08-2008, 03:11 PM
As for another idea, you might have the player play as a shabti (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabti), serving the pharoah and fending off treasure-hunters. The gameplay might be either platformer (which should build nicely on the San level) or top-down, and involve a mix of "errands" for the pharoah (getting items from bodies, fetching food, asking something of another mummy, etc.) and fighting against graverobbers. The playe can lose by either taking too long in an "errand", in which case the pharoah revokes his life, or by being destroyed by an adventurer.

That would be fun, fighting off graverobbers kinda like a Dungeon Keeper Lite :D

How about a 'building' puzzle?

Where you have to build a pyramid a certain way? i.e. you are given a bunch of jumbled puzzle pieces and you have to click on the different shapes to make the pyramid, but you have to use all of the pieces.

Erm, I'll draw you an example of what I mean when I get home.

Bonezmann
26-08-2008, 03:31 PM
Please do, i dont understand fully. But by the sound of it, it could work. The idea thaum gave sounds good as well, ill try it :)

Kensei
26-08-2008, 03:50 PM
Please do, i dont understand fully. But by the sound of it, it could work. The idea thaum gave sounds good as well, ill try it :)

I'd say its like the one mini-game in Chocobo Tales (on the DS) but I am not sure you have played that game :D

Bonezmann
26-08-2008, 04:05 PM
Unfortunately i havent, i dont have much love for the DS :)

Thaumaturge
26-08-2008, 08:14 PM
I think that I see what you mean, Kensei - something like this?

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/6681/pyramidpowernr3.th.png (http://img381.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pyramidpowernr3.png)

Except with the puzzle pieces rather more scrambled, I imagine. ;)

Kensei
26-08-2008, 09:22 PM
Yes! Thanks Thaum :D

Its basically what happens in Chocobo Tales but you are against other players so you it is dependant on speed and placement. So if you place a larger shape in the outline you get more points.

Thaumaturge
26-08-2008, 09:27 PM
My pleasure. ^_^

That Chocobo Tales minigame sounds interesting - it's essentially competitive tangrams, isn't it? An interesting mix.

Bonezmann
29-08-2008, 02:19 PM
Ill be adding the sounds and a seperate boss level to the san tonight, and ill experiment with more egypt themes as well. So you can expect a new update either late tonight or early tomorow morning. Unfortunately i might not be able to add more nations or races or whatever you may call it since the end is neas.

dislekcia
29-08-2008, 02:52 PM
No problemo, I was kinda hoping for a Japanese or Chinese themed level, maybe a Mayan/Aztec one too - but those can all come later in version 2 :)

Bonezmann
29-08-2008, 03:08 PM
It all depends on how much time i get to develop this weekend. Maybe there will be more. :)

Thaumaturge
30-08-2008, 05:48 AM
Come to think of it, a Mayan or Aztec level could be very cool indeed, I think. ^_^

Aval4nche
30-08-2008, 09:07 AM
Tried out the San proto. Really fun! Once you get the bugs ironed out, it'll be excellent. The art direction also rocks!

Little bit of nitpicking though. The san never lived in the Sahara. They lived in Southern Africa.

Bonezmann
30-08-2008, 09:14 AM
Yeah, that was my fault. At first i thought the kalahari was in north africa, until thaum corrected me. Ive corrected it in the new version, it should be up soon.

Aval4nche
30-08-2008, 10:37 AM
Excellent!

Bonezmann
30-08-2008, 10:40 AM
New version

Ancient History (http://www.gamedev.za.net/filecloset/data/files/570/ah.zip)

Will post bugs and info later, I quickly slipped away from work to post :)

Thaumaturge
31-08-2008, 06:21 AM
Your trophy icon and map seem much clearer to me now - good work. ^_^

I like the sounds that you added, and in particular the music - very well chosen, in tempo and sound, I think. ^_^

I'm interested to note that the San characters can now only move right - perhaps you should make minor change to your control description to indicate that the other keys don't seem to do anything in this level.

I also like the new boss level, although I found it a tad easy - but perhaps that's appropriate for an early level in the game.

My only criticism other than the control issue mentioned above is that I currently seem to have no reason to not simply spam spears at top speed - perhaps giving the characters a limited number of spears would help. Again, however, this may be acceptable for an early level in the game.

The Egypt level seems little changed, if at all, so I believe that my previous comments on that stand.

All in all, however, pretty good - and good luck for the competition. ^_^

Aval4nche
31-08-2008, 04:30 PM
Great job. The San level is much improved. I dig the boss battle.

In the Egypt section, you may want to set a timer to control your rate of fire. It's just too easy to spam icon and build the pyramid.

Kensei
31-08-2008, 07:03 PM
In the Egypt section, you may want to set a timer to control your rate of fire. It's just too easy to spam icon and build the pyramid.

Yes, lower the rate of fire and lower the speed that the blocks move.

It took me a moment to discover that I had failed the mission - because it just cut back to the first selection page... :(

Bonezmann
01-09-2008, 08:18 AM
I didnt make any changes to the egypt level, im thinking of doing something completely different with egypt. So tonight ill be devving like never before.