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Nandrew
13-08-2009, 10:01 PM
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/138/promoname.jpg

28 SEPTEMBER

This is it: the greatest Roguelike/Minesweeper hybrid that will ever exist in the universe ever ever. The gaming experience that will melt your brains from the inside out. The holy grail of fun. Maybe this is all an exaggeration, but either way ... welcome to Onslaught of the Electric Zombies!

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/7997/screenv02.png

Hordes of digital, undead nasties have infected your computer, and it's up to you to upload your personality, kick some ass and take back what's yours. Get as high a score as possible by exploring, fighting enemies and pulling off super-duper hacker feats that lesser mortals would tremble at the mere mention of. Then brag about it to your friends.

Get version 1.01 now (3.7 MB) (http://www.box.net/shared/gdd24i7vxi). Zombies are a proud bunch, so one day they decided that they simply couldn't do without a cool online score system for posterity's sake. That, and people who score well in games tend to have big, juicy brains. Yummy!

Thanks to everybody who provided their feedback and suggestions during development, especially over the last weekend. The game wouldn't be the way it is today if it wasn't for you. No, really: it sounds cheesy, but imagine what would've happened if I'd been allowed to create the game with all of my own crappy ideas intact? You'd probably still have something like version 0.1, and that wasn't really too great at all.

Go you! b^_^b

I can be contacted at rodain.joubert@devmag.org.za

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HALL OF HACKERS:
(Disclaimer: the online submission system is reasonably secure AFAIK, but we all know that stuff happens. Resist that devilish temptation to hack: it's a small game and not really worth the effort, so let's all just have fun instead. :3 If you DO find an exploit, tell me about it.)

SHORT GAME LEADERBOARD:
Current leader is: The Extremist - 64756 (Updated 12 Oct)
Full list (http://www.gmhighscores.com/highscores.php?gameid=407)

LONG GAME LEADERBOARD:
Current leader is: Brackard - 205764 (Updated 05 Oct)
Full list (http://www.gmhighscores.com/highscores.php?gameid=406)

Service provided by:
http://www.gmhighscores.com/supportgmh.gif (http://gmc.yoyogames.com/index.php?showtopic=417012)

--------------------------------------

MARKETING STUFFS

Above all else, Onslaught of the Electric Zombies was built to prove a point. For a competition. And since Comp 23 is all about marketing, I'm going to update this post with my marketing efforts and press coverage. And stuff.


MEDIA OUTLETS:

Mah blog (http://nandrew-chronicles.blogspot.com/) - contains a lot of random travel writing, but is being thematically extended to focus more on game dev. And, of course, the current Electric Zombies project.

Mah Twitter (https://twitter.com/RodainJoubert) - more of a general Twitter account, but it's gonna be focused on game development. Which, of course, means news updates about Electric Zombies.

Facebook fan page (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Onslaught-of-the-Electric-Zombies/138034104829) - Enjoy the game? Become a fan, cmaaaan. You just hafta click one button.


PRESS COVERAGE:

IndieGames (http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2009/09/freeware_game_pick_onslaught_o.html) - "... the classic Windows game ..." (quote taken horribly out of context to make me sound good. Wheee!)

IndieGames Part 2 (http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2009/09/update_onslaught_of_the_electr.html) - "The short mode is eight levels long, while a long game is twice that number." (Man, I'm ****ty at choosing pullquotes. But Tim *did* call it "awesome")

Technabob (http://technabob.com/blog/2009/09/08/onslaught-of-the-electric-zombies-minesweeper/) - "For a zombiefied Minesweeper style game, I might just be willing to venture into the land of the Internet." (that says an astounding amount: the Internet is a pretty screwed up place)

Gamasutra weekly indie roundup (http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=25207) - okay, this one's cheating. It's just a roundup including the aforementioned IndieGames review, but, well, it's a "best of", so I'm touting it.

dislekcia
14-08-2009, 02:26 AM
Game crashed for me on lvl 5. I'd just clicked a square that I was certain was going to be empty, it did the "pressed" animation and then crashed without revealing. I had the Defender in my only item slot, 1 level of tracking and 1 level of movement. Tile clicked was all the way on the right side of the board, 3 or 4 tiles down.

I'm going to play more of the game tomorrow when I'm not dying of a headache, but one thought I can't get out of my head is this: Why not provide people with an initial level up point right when they start and recommend they put it in tracking, that way people will be more familiar with the game from the start (without the numbers it's rather frustrating at first) but then more advanced players can try different "builds" with that initial skill point where they don't go tracking from the get go. Just an idea...

Also the green text on green BG is hard to read on my laptop screen.

Nandrew
14-08-2009, 10:54 AM
STOP PRESS! I've righteously found and squashed the cause of the game hang.

I'm uploading an updated version right at this moment, should be up in a few minutes.

Nandrew
14-08-2009, 11:03 AM
Right, the new version is up, and fortunately there weren't too many downloads just yet. So I should be in the clear for that one. <_< Thanks for feedback, d.

I like the idea of recommending a level of tracking from the start, actually ... while I've not found it to be strictly the *best* skill, it's definitely the most accessible for beginners.

Oh, and I'm going to fiddle about with the colours later. The game's going to get a reskinning soon if I snag a reasonably artsy type, and I'll be paying more attention to contrast and typeface and the like. ;)

herman.tulleken
18-08-2009, 10:45 AM
Love the game's core play! The way items and zombies interact is especially interesting, forcing you to change your strategy all the time, leading to a different game path every time you play, and this amidst the idea of hunting them down with the tracking info.

Some issues (I apologise if I sound like a whining dummy; take from it what you will).

Initially I didn't get it at all - did I have to kill the enemies? How? (I thought maybe you had to do something special to not get damage). It also seemed like I was just clicking away without any purpose. Also, choosing when to leave a level was initially confusing; I expected the system to "let me go" to the next level, and played, well, until all the squares have been clicked (I actually thought maybe the "next level" button was a "test" feature to allow testers (like us) to see what other levels are like).

Of course, how it all works became apparent after playing awhile; think you might just explain or show it better.

The effect of some zombies was also a bit hard to understand.

The snipers, for example. When do they actually shoot? It takes 20 turns for them to load, but when do they start loading? I thought it was at the beginning of the level, but am sure I took more than 20 turns the one time. The other time it took me totally off-guard.

The Marauders introduce a very interesting play mechanic (it almost inverts the game), but it was also not clear initially how to handle them (of course, you should *kill* them, but as I explained - how to kill a zombie was not so clear).

I also could not figure out how the poison works. At one stage, I saw 3 numbers flying; was the third related to poison?

The Zombie King's warning about you not having enough energy to kill him and survive sounded like a shallow taunt, so of course I tried to kill him a few times... and I couldn't see how much energy I was actually loosing to see whether I am right. Perhaps this is intentional, but if it *is* possible to kill him, you might consider giving the player some hint as to what amount of energy he actually needs (even if it is after he kills you - for next time!)

Also, [and now this is really just impression + opinion advice, easily I could be wrong here], the mid-levels seem to be somewhat randomised. You might want to "filter" your randomisation a bit - at one stage I got two sniper levels in a row, which is not quite as exciting as getting a new level every time. I can also imagine that getting two Marauder levels in a row might be problematic.

A dramatic warning when energy is low would also be helpful; I often did not notice when my energy was being depleted.

I also missed the text messages at the bottom, and got the impression that I also missed some dialogs (perhaps by accidentally dismissing them; perhaps by some interface bug), but I can't be sure.

I also think the grading at the end ("hacker") could be put in some context. I got that rating every time, so I don't know whether it is good or bad. (I.e, is it "noob", ..., "hacker", or "hacker", ..., "devil hacker"). There is much more incentive to play again when you know if you do better, you will become a "super hacker" or whatever.

Another thing that bothered my a little is the 30% penalty if you die. I would prefer a retirement bonus instead (to be honest, I never actually retired [always trying to kill the king], so maybe it is there). It makes it easier to "analyse your risk" if you are aiming for some specific score... but this is really just my personal preference.

One thing to watch out for: the game allows for a degenerate strategy, something like randomly clicking "probably safe" cells in certain levels, quickly skipping the "difficult" levels, and then retiring. With this you can get a score of almost 4000 (even if you die in the last level) without really playing (and enjoying) it.

Finally, because it is so much fun, the game feels awfully short. (I can see making a longer game can present some problems of its own - for example, then saving progress, etc. becomes an issue).

Oh yes - and I would love a cheat for no imps getting into the game!


Look forward to the next version,

ht

Chippit
18-08-2009, 11:13 AM
I agree with a lot of Herman's points here. I particularly found that the game was unclear in the beginning (understanding that this is a prototype, I dismissed this issue as something to be handled with a tutorial of sorts - it probably helped that I'd played Gearsweeper too), as well as the issue with missing some dialogs at the bottom. Many of them seem to progress immediately and on their own, seemingly due to multiple things happening at the same time.

As for the zombie king, the first time I defeated him was actually with that power that lets you kill enemies you've completely surrounded for free (which I adored from Gearsweeper too!). It felt like a bit of a cheap victory for that, though, but he certainly is not invulnerable. :P

On the note of poison, it appears that it deals damage to you at the end of every turn, and, similar to how the marauder levels work, their damage is affected by your defence ability, so it often takes multiple 'doses' to actually begin to injure you. I think, to make effects like this easier to see, the health change popups should be staggered, and not appear all at once.

Nandrew
18-08-2009, 03:14 PM
Thanks! The feedback has been generous, and you guys will be happy to know that I've already fixed most of the problems you've mentioned: the next version should be out in a few days.

Step-by-step address:


Initially I didn't get it at all - did I have to kill the enemies? How? (I thought maybe you had to do something special to not get damage). It also seemed like I was just clicking away without any purpose. Also, choosing when to leave a level was initially confusing; I expected the system to "let me go" to the next level, and played, well, until all the squares have been clicked (I actually thought maybe the "next level" button was a "test" feature to allow testers (like us) to see what other levels are like).


Those problems have been somewhat addressed. Firstly, there is now a rudimentary tutorial system that enlightens the player through dialog. About 50% of these messages mention at some point: "By the way, you really should just go ahead and fight them thar enemies". ;) From the feedback I've received from, like, everyone, this seems to be the point that needs stressing the most.

I've also shaken up the level progression system somewhat. Now, there's a few "level exit" blocks scattered across each grid. You have to uncover at least one before you're allowed to progress. This feels a lot better than the old system, which was definitely prone to unsatisfactory skipping.



The snipers, for example. When do they actually shoot? It takes 20 turns for them to load, but when do they start loading? I thought it was at the beginning of the level, but am sure I took more than 20 turns the one time. The other time it took me totally off-guard.

The Marauders introduce a very interesting play mechanic (it almost inverts the game), but it was also not clear initially how to handle them (of course, you should *kill* them, but as I explained - how to kill a zombie was not so clear).

You were confused about the snipers because they were BROKEN. :P I've added it as a known issue to the list in the first post. Snipers currently don't do damage and don't give you score -- this will be fixed with the next upload.

Marauders may be a bit unclear, yeah ... I'm hoping that the tutorial will prepare players for regular enemies, and that they'll be able to infer the marauder's purpose somewhat. This is actually the primary issue that I'm wrestling with at the moment: giving the player adequate information versus the thrill of players discovering things for themselves.



I also could not figure out how the poison works. At one stage, I saw 3 numbers flying; was the third related to poison?

Yep. This is actually another issue that I'm struggling with: I'm trying to convey turn-by-turn information to the player while not overwhelming them. Sometimes a lot of stuff just happens at once, you know? For the meantime, I think I'll just merge poison and regular damage effects so that there's not a third number weighing you down.


The Zombie King's warning about you not having enough energy to kill him and survive sounded like a shallow taunt, so of course I tried to kill him a few times... and I couldn't see how much energy I was actually loosing to see whether I am right. Perhaps this is intentional, but if it *is* possible to kill him, you might consider giving the player some hint as to what amount of energy he actually needs (even if it is after he kills you - for next time!)


I think that, in the death dialog, I'll tell players exactly how much damage they were dealt. I like the idea of players educating themselves through a *little bit* of trial and error (therefore becoming better at the game), and I think this is fair as long as I make death itself a learning experience. I believe good Roguelikes do deadly education rather well. :P


Also, [and now this is really just impression + opinion advice, easily I could be wrong here], the mid-levels seem to be somewhat randomised. You might want to "filter" your randomisation a bit - at one stage I got two sniper levels in a row, which is not quite as exciting as getting a new level every time. I can also imagine that getting two Marauder levels in a row might be problematic.

Yeah, that was another bug. I think it's squashed now: all random levels inside a given play session *should* be unique.


A dramatic warning when energy is low would also be helpful; I often did not notice when my energy was being depleted.

I also missed the text messages at the bottom, and got the impression that I also missed some dialogs (perhaps by accidentally dismissing them; perhaps by some interface bug), but I can't be sure.

Done. Beeps and flashes and everything. :) I've also added warnings or timers to certain dangerous events such as the zombie bomb and sniper levels.

The messages at the bottom aren't terribly important: they usually only deal with common game events ("you uncovered an enemy, there is danger nearby, etc"). If you've been accidentally dismissing dialog boxes, however, then that's a cause for concern. I'll try sort something out to reduce that possibility.



I also think the grading at the end ("hacker") could be put in some context. I got that rating every time, so I don't know whether it is good or bad. (I.e, is it "noob", ..., "hacker", or "hacker", ..., "devil hacker"). There is much more incentive to play again when you know if you do better, you will become a "super hacker" or whatever.

Another thing that bothered my a little is the 30% penalty if you die. I would prefer a retirement bonus instead (to be honest, I never actually retired [always trying to kill the king], so maybe it is there). It makes it easier to "analyse your risk" if you are aiming for some specific score... but this is really just my personal preference.

Eh, the first point is a proto thing. :P Actually, you can never get a rating other than "hacker" because I haven't programmed it to say anything EXCEPT "hacker" yet! I'll try get a proper ratings system (and a rudimentary high score table) into the next version, since score is kinda important in this game.

I really like the retirement bonus suggestion, actually. I think it has a nicer psychological effect on the player: rather than getting a "penalty for dying", you get a "reward for living". Nice.


As for the zombie king, the first time I defeated him was actually with that power that lets you kill enemies you've completely surrounded for free (which I adored from Gearsweeper too!). It felt like a bit of a cheap victory for that, though, but he certainly is not invulnerable. :P

Hoo boy, everybody's interested in the zombie king. :P

The zombie king is something of a glass cannon: he's incredibly tough to defeat, but if you strike him in the right situation, he crumbles. This may be a controversial decision, and I worry about the "hollow victory" that Chippit reports, but I'm moulding this boss character after the Yellow Kawangi in Weird Worlds who, similarly, are very intimidating and almost impossible to defeat unless you happen to have a fortuitous game run, in which case there's several ways to defeat them very, very easily.

I justify this decision because I want a boss battle that the player CAN'T just win every time ... making victory (and the massive score bonus) all the more sweeter on the occasions when it is possible. :)

For the spoilerific record, the zombie king deals 100 base damage. Keep that in mind when you try to fight him. ;)



Also, I know that the current game sessions feel short, and again I'm following the Weird Worlds approach to this problem: once I feel that I've got a respectable 8-level system up and running, I'm going to give the player the option of playing short (8-level), medium (16-level), and long (24-level) play sessions. Each length has its own scoreboard, so it'll be simple player preference regarding how long they want to be in the game, and how much they want to develop their character.

This has been planned from the start: it just hasn't been implemented yet. ;)


...

And yeah, wow again! Thanks for the extensive feedback, this is all being jotted into my design doccie for consideration and to-do. :)

herman.tulleken
18-08-2009, 05:50 PM
You were confused about the snipers because they were BROKEN. :P I've added it as a known issue to the list in the first post.

Oops... (I saw it, but then read later that you fixed something, and thought it was that. Re-reading properly, I see it was not...)



I also could not figure out how the poison works.


Yep. This is actually another issue that I'm struggling with: I'm trying to convey turn-by-turn information to the player while not overwhelming them. Sometimes a lot of stuff just happens at once, you know?


If this was a character game (I mean, where the player had a visible character), you could make a poisoned character green, and green damage would easily be linked to it. Perhaps you can still use this device somehow, perhaps tinting the board green, or something like that. (Even if you keep the coupling with normal damage, something like this could still help explain what is going on. It will also make it more striking when the effect stops).

(I think this "enough" vs. "overload" problem is very common in game design. It is sometimes helpful to think of a solution on a board game - it is such a reduced "interface", that any solution is usually non-obvious, so it's helpful to get out of a thinking-rut.)

I look forward to see the changes you describe in action!

Nandrew
18-08-2009, 05:53 PM
I think, then, that I'm going to just lump in poison damage with any other damage that takes place (so just a single damage indicator per turn), and use green sheen to show you that part of that damage is poison. Thanks for the brain bounce. :)

Nandrew
23-08-2009, 07:26 PM
A new version is up, with a whole whack of improvements and even some core changes to the gameplay. Be sure to snap it up and provide me with:

(A) your feedback
(B) your top score. :)

Credit goes to Nathan Pożarycki for the new art, since he has officially become my drawering-wizard-thing for the duration of this project. I'll try get him to come around and say hi, but feel free to leave your comments and suggestions for him in the meantime.

Fengol
23-08-2009, 08:13 PM
I do have a complaint about Quarantine; if the zombie is on the edge of the map it can't be completely surrounded by explored tiles and you can't use the item on it. Surely, if I've checked all available surrounding tiles it should work?

Nandrew
23-08-2009, 08:18 PM
Nope. Quarantine is a pretty awesome item as it is. I forbid abusing its divine power any more than necessary.

8 tiles only. And maybe dessert.

Fengol
23-08-2009, 08:57 PM
on my first try:



For a start, you died before retiring.
You recovered 529 clean sectors.
You went toe-to-toe with 32 electric minions.
You also recovered 7 system artifacts, for better or worse

Your final score is 10765 points.


It would be nice to have totals to compare to. 529 clean sectors versus? how many artifacts did I miss? Is there a bonus for finding all the artifacts, for better or worse?

It should also say what level you died on so you can screen shot an share...

Nandrew
27-08-2009, 12:09 AM
One of my friends swung this over to me yesterday:

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/3345/electriczombiegod600.jpg

How is this screenshot awesome? Let me count the ways:

(1) It's really flattering to see a player this enthusiastic about the game even at such a tentative stage in its development. I have somebody officially hooked! \:D/

(2) Barring my own personal high score (which kinda doesn't count), he's got the best end-game that I've seen from anybody so far.

(3) He's included Han Solo. Playing a guitar.

This piece of flagrant self-indulgence brought to you by Unicorns(TM). It's also an excuse to thank everybody else for the feedback that they've provided so far -- most of it has been over Gtalk, but I totally officially recognise your efforts and support and stuff. :3

dislekcia
27-08-2009, 02:48 AM
OMW! That's awesome :)

How friggin motivating is that picture of Han rocking out? Damn.

Fengol
27-08-2009, 08:50 AM
This means you totally got to have an easter egg graphic that displays when you beat the top score.

herman.tulleken
27-08-2009, 09:17 AM
Finally managed to play the updated version. I like the improvements you've made. Especially the exit blocks (in certain levels they provide a lot of tension [like when you have 10 energy in a Marauder level!]). Art is also pretty cool, especially background.

Overall, the tutorial and extra info (timers, etc.) makes everything a lot clearer now, I think (but of course I cannot speak for a newcomer anymore).

Small things:

Perhaps you can include a poison explanation in the tutorial.
Interfacewise, the dialogs at the very beginning would look nicer in the game's look-and-feel.
At times the long text attached to the cursor was a bit distracting (although impossible to miss!)
Would be nice if the final screen explicitly says "You killed the Zombie King" (!!)


(And what about screaming zombie sound effects? And recorded Aaaahs! and such that plays when you press the button with that name :-)

(PS - my score is still in the administrator range)

ht

Nandrew
27-08-2009, 02:09 PM
Finally managed to play the updated version. I like the improvements you've made. Especially the exit blocks (in certain levels they provide a lot of tension [like when you have 10 energy in a Marauder level!]). Art is also pretty cool, especially background.

Overall, the tutorial and extra info (timers, etc.) makes everything a lot clearer now, I think (but of course I cannot speak for a newcomer anymore).

Small things:

Perhaps you can include a poison explanation in the tutorial.
Interfacewise, the dialogs at the very beginning would look nicer in the game's look-and-feel.
At times the long text attached to the cursor was a bit distracting (although impossible to miss!)
Would be nice if the final screen explicitly says "You killed the Zombie King" (!!)


(And what about screaming zombie sound effects? And recorded Aaaahs! and such that plays when you press the button with that name :-)

(PS - my score is still in the administrator range)

ht

Haha, awesome! I'm glad you like the exit block idea: goodness knows that I've literally escaped from a marauder level with a single health point before.

- The poison example is a bit of a tricky point. I'm actually going to be implementing quite a lot of different enemies with some rather exotic attack types, and I really need something like poison effects to be quite clear *without* subjecting the player to a tutorial dialog when it happens. Because if I do it for that sort of enemy, I have to do it for a bunch of other effects, and I want to minimise the very stark gameplay interruptions that these messages are already creating.

- The GM default dialogs at the beginning are a blight upon mankind and my game, and I hope to remove every last one of their miserable kind from existence. :P I'll be working on a title screen / menu interface for the next version: I'm kinda tired of having to answer the same questions during every play session, so it's time to streamline that.

- Are you talking about the long text at the beginning of the tutorial which attaches itself to your mouse for the first few moves? Yeah, it's been designed to be impossible to miss. :P I hope that it doesn't interfere *too* much, though: once the player has made about five moves, I remove that text and just let them get on with playing confidently because the tut message *can* get bloody annoying. And, of course, there's the option to not receive tutorial messages at all. ;)

- I really like the idea of more detailed feedback at the end of a game scenario, and Fengol's mentioned certain things he'd like to see from the end-game screen as well. Major game events (such as the defeat of the king) are definitely promising ideas. :)

- The sound effects I'm still a bit iffy on. I've decided to explore a new avenue with this game's audio and have thus far made my entire SFX library consist of "retro"-themed effects to fit in with the idea of waltzing through a computer. What I *could* try do is see if I can synth screams and the like, but I'm reluctant to do full-quality sounds that could break the theme. This does bring up a good point though: how do people feel about the retro sound theme? I want to revise and develop it further, and will hopefully be backing it with an appropriate music track in a later release.


Thanks for the continued feedback, folks!

Fengol
27-08-2009, 03:07 PM
surely if you mix in a lot of static into the screams and noises it'll be sufficiently 8-bit? Maybe watch the recent wolfenstein restrospective on gametrailers to hear what initial speech sounded like on the Apple II

Nandrew
27-08-2009, 04:04 PM
I could do that, yeah. Though I suspect that I'll have to be a lot more careful than just adding static and noise. Will probably look up some readings on the matter.

Fengol
27-08-2009, 04:32 PM
surely though, you can parse the sound through an 8 bit filter?

herman.tulleken
27-08-2009, 05:45 PM
Personally, I like the retro theme. It would be interesting how far it can be pushed.

But I do think you might also loose out on milking the zombie aspect if you do not also include a little bit of "organic" sound (not necessarily screams), I mean, if it is too techno. The "appeal" for zombies as monsters is after all that they are smelly, slimy, disgusting things that want to kill you (inside a computer or out ;-) [I also take a cue here from how they are portrayed in the game].

Also, in the end it won't be so much the quality of the sound as the "timber" that will establish your theme.

Anyways, that's my 2c on the matter.


- The poison example is a bit of a tricky point. I'm actually going to be implementing quite a lot of different enemies with some rather exotic attack types, and I really need something like poison effects to be quite clear *without* subjecting the player to a tutorial dialog when it happens.

See what you mean here...and I guess you will have a similar problem with every type of monster. (And maybe it is not a big/real problem in the first place).

ht

Nandrew
27-08-2009, 06:14 PM
I definitely want to do a good job of the sound, so I'll be taking these comments into consideration for the next version. I'll see if I can start with some more sounds that mix organic and retro-electro. So far, it's sounding like something that could easily be done wrong, so I'm going to approach it cautiously.

Hopefully, I'll be able to pull it off to satisfaction.

dislekcia
27-08-2009, 07:05 PM
Could you make Marauders take off health according to distance from them? That would make hunting the bastards down a little easier.

Nandrew
27-08-2009, 08:18 PM
Hey, that's a pretty cool idea. It would add an element of skill otherwise not present in the hunt. I'll try it out.

Agrajag
27-08-2009, 10:04 PM
I love your game. It's feeding very nicely off my minesweeper addiction. The tutorial is implemented well too.

One thing that I think it could use right now is music. Or, not really music as much as ambiant beaty sort of stuff. Something with a very arcady puzzle type vibe, like in Peggle.

vii
28-08-2009, 03:40 PM
Ok, I tried this last night... Dammit, it's addictive as all hell! STOP IT! AAAAH!

I'll be testing it out a bit more to get some advice for you... so far it's quite fun.

herman.tulleken
29-08-2009, 04:33 PM
http://code-spot.co.za/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/ht_hiscore1.png

;-))

PS- when you discover and kill all the snipers, the five second warning still comes up. [I know I had them all, because of the diagnostic tool].

ht

Nandrew
29-08-2009, 05:26 PM
Awesome score! And a game bug is hunted down as a bonus -- sweet. ;)

I'm glad you guys are enjoying the experience: I'm looking at giving the next version another week of dev, and there will be a lot more content to play around with then. :)

I'd also like to introduce my artist, Heldjinn ... I know the bugger's lurking around here somewhere, so presumably he'll take this as a cue to say "sup" at some point.

Karuji
01-09-2009, 08:39 AM
I spent too much time playing this last night. Been trying out different combos to see which gets the highest score.

Got to say I HATE poison.

And more releases please, must fuel the addiction.

Nandrew
03-09-2009, 01:46 PM
Awesome!

Oh, hey, I've also updated the first post with Comp-23-related stuff. I'd like y'all to read through: some of the spiel I've written will most likely interest (and benefit) other Comp 23 entrants.

dammit
03-09-2009, 06:53 PM
Downloading this and losing a few hours of my life (no doubt) this weekend to it :)

In the mean time, this



- Second corararallyarly: (IMPORTANT) I think that working closely with other projects and doing a bit of cross-marketing can be mutually beneficial, and I'm interested in seeing how the entrants in this competition can hold each other up. To this end, I've already been chatting with Gazza about putting an advert for Electric Zombies into his game's quit screen (and vice versa) if the comp deadline permits him finishing Gears JRPG. D's *also* mentioned putting a generic "marketing screen" into all of the competition entries which could point to a central hub of the games and broaden the audience further. Chippit may also be scribbling up some code for a "showcase" on Dev.Mag, which could be the destination for this pointery. There's a few possibilities here, and I'd like to pursue at least one of these avenues.

sounds like a series of brilliant ideas. I'd also suggest for those using facebook, sharing everyone "fan pages" with our own contacts, as well as linking the fan pages to each other. Same with twitter :)

Chippit
03-09-2009, 10:47 PM
...Chippit may also be scribbling up some code for a "showcase" on Dev.Mag, which could be the destination for this pointery. There's a few possibilities here, and I'd like to pursue at least one of these avenues.
Gawd damn. I see what you did there. Now you know I'll have to do it. You tricksy bastard.

dislekcia
04-09-2009, 01:34 AM
Gawd damn. I see what you did there. Now you know I'll have to do it. You tricksy bastard.

High five Nandrew. High ****ing five.

Chippit
04-09-2009, 03:10 AM
YOU WERE IN ON THIS TOO! IT'S ALL A CONSPIRACY!

Edit: I think I need an angrier avatar. This one negates the effects of capslock simply by being serene and purple.

Evil_Toaster
04-09-2009, 04:43 AM
YOU WERE IN ON THIS TOO! IT'S ALL A CONSPIRACY!

Edit: I think I need an angrier avatar. This one negates the effects of capslock simply by being serene and purple.

You won't like him when he's angry...

http://www.retrotoast.com/downloads/images/EvilChippitDragon.png

Chippit
04-09-2009, 12:59 PM
AWESOME.

Nandrew
04-09-2009, 01:02 PM
D:

Evil_Toaster
04-09-2009, 04:33 PM
\O/

dislekcia
07-09-2009, 12:37 AM
Yay! Made it to CyberGod status, 26k :) Got a different ending to the zombie king one, awesome!

Quick question: Do you level up at specific score points? If so, could this be made graphically obvious? Might be a great push to players to make them do risky things to clear a level and get that bonus.

F1ak3r
07-09-2009, 05:51 AM
Evidence you're getting the word out. (http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2009/09/freeware_game_pick_onslaught_o.html)

Karuji
07-09-2009, 08:38 AM
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o278/Dark_Master_Image/zombiecybergod.png

Finally got to cybergod. and this had to be one of my most interesting play throughs.

Took tough level one and ran into source code(so I thought this would be a good game).

Level two was snipers and no diagnostic tool :( so I took track but I didn't get them all.

Because I deviated from my normal build I ended up taking a lot of damage.

So it comes to the last level i have 30 energy and the zombie king around. Fortuneately I can clean one tile. So I take the second level of track, and wouldn't ye know I got lucky and hit the right tile :D Then I retired.

Just out of curiosity how would volatile file and looping code work together?

Edit: Just broke my own personal score, and the 30k mark. And am also a few points short of HT's best :(

picy (http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o278/Dark_Master_Image/zombiecybergodv2.png)

This is starting to boarder on obsession :P . It's line wars all over again >.>

dammit
07-09-2009, 08:28 PM
If you press F1 during full screen game mode you get a blank white screen. Just thought you'd like to know ;) Quite addictive this, though I seem to have missed the point as I'm getting worse instead of better.

Nandrew
08-09-2009, 01:31 PM
Evidence you're getting the word out. (http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2009/09/freeware_game_pick_onslaught_o.html)

That's awesome! But I have mixed feelings about them finding it *right now*. I didn't want to send this to the IndieGames blog until after it was complete: I doubt I'll get a re-feature for the finished version.

Though, for the purpose of this competition, that should still be pretty sweet. I think it's also a valuable reminder to entrants that web coverage is ... well ... easy! I didn't even send the game to these guys, they just managed to hunt it down.

I think I'm going to revise my goals for game content: I'll have to have it down and final very soon. Expect massive changes when I get the next version out.

dammit
11-09-2009, 02:19 PM
Cybergod! 27290 \o/

Aequitas
11-09-2009, 07:29 PM
Got to CyberGod on my second try ^_^

Gotta say ... great game nandrew :D

http://h.imagehost.org/0528/win.png (http://h.imagehost.org/view/0528/win)

vii
12-09-2009, 12:57 AM
Got to CyberGod on my second try ^_^

Gotta say ... great game nandrew :D

http://h.imagehost.org/0528/win.png (http://h.imagehost.org/view/0528/win)

</3
Im still at tech wizard after like... 10 games ;_;

Nandrew
12-09-2009, 08:16 PM
Umm, okay. I've struggled with Internet this past week. Much hair has been lost, and much game commenting needs to be caught up on.

First of all: REALLY stoked that you guys are continuing to enjoy the game! :D Every new post I see fills me with:

(1) Bunnies
(2) Sunshine
(3) Hax!

The latest proto is a bit late in coming out because I'm keen to make the next release the FINAL one. I'm cutting out a few features, trimming a few corners and generally working on tightening up what I've devved so far instead of adding anything new. The clamps are on, so to speak, and hopefully the next game thingie you see on these frumz will be a full-blown product.

If anybody is interested in playtesting a closed beta of the game just before release, please let me know and I'll organise getting a copy to you. I know this sounds a bit silly and fancy, but if I release a buggy version openly and the press somehow gets their hands on it, I'll just, like, die or something.

Also, I got a rather interesting email today from my FILE HOST regarding the Gears of War Minesweeper. I'd like to submit the transcript for consideration in the marketing comp. It gave me a fright, I'll tell you, but I might as well post for great Comp 23 justice and as a bit of a pointer for fellow entrants:


To whom it may concern,

We have recently received a complaint regarding the following file(s), which you have been sharing through your Box.net account, and infringe on a previously-held copyright:

MyBox/GearsSweeper_v01.exe

We have deleted the above file(s) from your account. Please delete any other files from your account that may infringe on any previously-held copyrights, as these go against the Box.net Terms of Service. Be aware that further infractions may result in account termination.

Sincerely,
The Box.net team

Between the Dev.Mag article and, surprisingly, an IndieGames review (http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2009/09/freeware_game_pick_gears_of_wa.html) (yep, both GOW and Electric Zombies are on there now), I seem to have garnered enough attention to make somebody sit up, take notice and slap me on the wrist.

Ooer. So yeah. If you're marketing something from Comp 22 and are using Box.net as a host, please take this as a warning.

dislekcia
13-09-2009, 03:04 AM
I bet you it was a single complainant who didn't even play the game and rated it based entirely on the title/description in one of those reviews.

dammit
13-09-2009, 02:58 PM
Bummer about GOW Minesweeper. Box.net has yet to decide that TF2puzzler is a copyright infringement so I guess I'm not getting the word out as much as I should ;)

Also, I have to agree with dislekcia. It would seem more reasonable to give the first Track to the player. Also, is there some way you can indicate what level you are on with any one of those...erm, items? I realise that you've worded the descriptions to indicate this, but it might be easier to have a colour code with, say, a darker colour indicating you're on a higher level (of "Move" for example). Just a thought because I'm too lazy to read and I forget what I already have :P

Also, does this mean I get a cookie now?
http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk157/dammit62/Untitled-5.jpg

Nandrew
13-09-2009, 10:41 PM
Neato! With changes in the next version, the score system may differ somewhat, so be prepared for a new take on the challenges. :P

Nandrew
13-09-2009, 10:48 PM
Oh, also, found this on Gamasutra. I include this link for more Competition 23 great justice-ness:

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=25207

My game was featured in the Best of Indie Games weekly roundup. Yay. \:D/

Bonezmann
15-09-2009, 08:54 PM
This had a play, awesome 'variant' on the whole minesweeper thing. I chuckled at a few of those tutorial messages...

Nandrew
15-09-2009, 11:31 PM
Received this message a little earlier:


Hey,

just wanted to say I enjoyed the game. I'd have posted but I guess I don't have permissions. I followed the link from over at gamasutra.

Pulled off scores of 30k+ a couple times and 25k+ consistently. 30k scores were from the swarm finale, not killing the king.

Pretty good balance between the different strategies.

The "Tough" strategy:
using toughness to make yourself able to gain score by killing enemies and clearing levels

The "Item" strategy: (little bit weaker)
increasing slots to be able to maximize score on final level (whether boss or swarm)

The "move" strategy: increasing movement score instantly to maximize your exploration score

The biggest issue I have is the marauders. With toughness, I'm able to withstand the drain (unless they swarmed with -5/round), but any other strategy is rather weak. Simply skipping the level (by finding the exit out of necessity), will often kill any chance of a non-toughness character getting the high scores. I really don't see any downfall of NOT taking the toughness strategy, especially if you find the defender early. I think for the marauders, you need to do something you do with snipers or the bomb - give them some kind of count down while they 'find' you before they begin sucking energy. That would put everyone on a bit more equal footing.

Additionally, I really couldn't find a use for the energy regen. There was nothing I could do where I couldn't maximize my score MORE by picking something else. If the increase were to be doubled, or maybe an increase per monster killed, or something like that, it might make more sense.

Anyway, sorry for the unsolicited feedback, but I enjoyed the game and wanted to give you my opinions. Everyone has some. Take of them what you will.

-B

Thanks a bunch, Brackard! I don't know many people who would go to this effort to provide feedback to the dev. It's greatly appreciated and I've responded to your comment via PM. ;)

I'd like to know from the other peeps here: does anything in this feedback ring any bells with you guys? Anything you'd like to reinforce or suggest based on this statement? The game is nearing completion, but it's still pretty malleable in terms of game balance and the like. I've been a bit slow on dev over the past week (no end of grief with the computer, for some reason) so there's still a reasonable window for any last-minute feedback before I lock features down.

dammit
16-09-2009, 09:43 AM
The marauders issue rings a bell. Without a defender or toughness upgrade, you often just lose trying to find the exit.

One strategy i found that works well is to not take your advice about killing everything on the first level to get the bonus for that level. Simply clear all the empty blocks and then move to the next level where you can actually pick something up to help with the zombie horde fighting. You're also then still on full health and no longer need to be concerned about getting a regen upgrade.

Funnily enough, I got my highest scores on the zombie king finals and not the horde finals, but i haven't got over 30K :P

herman.tulleken
16-09-2009, 10:07 AM
Yes, this sounds right to me too. I found myself running out of energy a lot, so I tried versions of the "Regen" strategy without success. The tough strategy works very well, especially if you increase items slots with one early on. Toughness is also indespensible to withstanding poison.

But I think the track strategy is the weakest (as cool as it is).

Have you tried out the distance-dependent energy sucking marauders Dis suggested yet? Thought that was a very cool idea.

ht

dammit
16-09-2009, 11:01 AM
Oh, one more thing, I think you need to explain the "poison" and what it does early one. The first time I got a message mentioning poison I didn't really understand what you were going on about.

Nandrew
16-09-2009, 10:01 PM
There's a lot of game balance tweaks going on, so I thought I'd update you guys with a few of 'em (since they're relevant to what's being said right now):

- Marauders can no longer attack you from anywhere in the level. They have a square radius of influence, so you'll get hurt if you get close enough, and can use that information (sorta) to work out where the bastards are hiding. At the very least, they'll not hit you quite so hard.

- Spiders and poison are going to ease off more on earlier levels, and will probably be inserted later instead. They're now unofficially classified as "advanced" enemies, and player mentality should be adjusted accordingly. I've added a note for toughness: namely that it's useful against spider poison. Hopefully players will get the point without me having to blare a "YOU HAVE BEEN POISONED!" message every time they stumble across one of these buggers.

- Regeneration has been buffed slightly. Now, instead of simply increasing energy regain, it also increases your maximum health. Somebody who is suitably souped up on regen should be able to go toe-to-toe with the zombie king and live through the encounter without any item assistance.

- Tracking is still the same, but I've increased its power indirectly with some new enemy designs. In the upcoming version of the game, knowing exactly which enemy you're about to face can make the difference between a huge score bonus and certain death. The order in which you fight enemies will also become a lot more important. This promotes the idea of levelling up the skill fully.

- ALL skills have been more liberally showered onto players now. You get one new skill point for EVERY SINGLE STAGE. Yay! \:D/ I think this should change the game dynamic considerably: now it's not a matter of choosing which skills you'll use, but more which skills you'll get FIRST.

--------

Overall, actual game content has been finalised. Now I'm working on stuff like balance, polish, bugfixes and ... eugh ... the UI.

I see the end in sight, and it smells delicious.

Karuji
17-09-2009, 06:23 PM
Well I'll throw in my 2c here since I'm rather the addict.

I always take tough first level to clear and get the bonus. I hope I get zombie source code or the take one less damage item this generally points to having a good start.

Second level is where things start to come down to choice. Depending on the item I got on the first level I will either take regen tough or slot. In general the tough was my choice if I lacked a good item. But an extra 10 points per level does come in handy, but you have to weigh it against poison damage and items.

By the end. I generally get 2 level of track (the second level being on the final level, and the first to deal with snipers if I don't have a map reveal). this is my strat that got me over 30k, double track allow me to locate the king then I use an item to kill him and retire to get that sweet 30% bonus, I've never beat the swarm

Nandrew
17-09-2009, 08:29 PM
Thanks for the additional feedback! You guys may find that a lot of your tactics will collapse in this next release: a LOT of balance tweaks and gameplay changes mean that you'll probably need to rethink your game experience. I hope that this proves to be both exciting and refreshing -- and ideally, can promote a game where different players use a variety of tactics to reach the same goal. :)

Nandrew
17-09-2009, 08:40 PM
Also, a conversation from mid dev:



Nandrew: I need a "Swizzler" for the next level to blind the player's tracking. What sort of enemy graphic do you think you can come up with?

Heldjinn: I dunno. Swizzler sounds generic. How about making it a zombie ninja instead?

Nandrew: Ooh, yeah

Heldjinn: And, like, another enemy could be a zombie pirate

Nandrew: Holy ****

Nandrew: HOLY ****

Nandrew: YES!

Nandrew: A bonus level which pits a horde of zombie ninjas and zombie pirates fighting against each other!

Heldjinn: Sweet!

Nandrew: IT WILL BE THE GAME SCENARIO OF THE CENTURY!

Also, as mentioned earlier, game content has been finalised. So you can guess what you'll expect on future playthroughs.

dislekcia
17-09-2009, 11:49 PM
Zombie ninjas should only be visible if you're "really" close to them, so they only give tracking on the cardinal neighbours, not diagonals...

How are zombie pirates different?

Nandrew
18-09-2009, 11:20 AM
Currently, the stats go as follows:

A zombie ninja attacks you with a smoke bomb and blinds you for the rest of the level. No matter how high your tracking skill is, you're basically screwed over when it comes to hunting down enemies on that particular grid.

A zombie pirate swipes at you with a hooked hand (yo ho ho!). Because he's a zombie, his hand inadvertently detaches itself and gets lodged in your shoulder (or something) for the rest of the level. All toughness bonuses are temporarily removed.

-------

To be honest, I just released the descriptions as a teaser. I'm starting to lock down actual features and things now that I'm entering the bugfix cycle: the more I change at this point, the more work it becomes to re-test and all that other stuff. And I've set myself a deadline for this proggie.

To that end: I'm making one final run through the game TODAY to test for major bugs and system-breaking problems. Once that's done, I'm going to be recruiting playtesters to have a go at the game this weekend. Their mission: to hunt down any other bugs that I may have missed.

If any of you are interested in getting a preview play this weekend, tell me about it and I'll swing you a link when the time comes. Just understand that you'll be playing an UNSTABLE version and that your primary job is to HUNT FOR BUGS. Unless it's really really really frikkin important, I'm not going to be making any more gameplay changes at this stage: most alterations now will just create a need for more playtesting and further mathematical headaches for me, which won't do well since I want the final game out on Monday.

Yep, Monday. So if you don't fancy yourself a tester, just sit tight and wait for this weekend to pass! What you'll hopefully have is a complete, honest-to-goodness game from me which you can enjoy and share wiff alla yer fwends. :3

Nandrew
18-09-2009, 10:31 PM
Pre-final is live! \o/

Link is going out to selected playtesters.

If you're interested in playing over this weekend and I've forgotten to give you a link, jostle my memory and and I'll send it to you.

All I'm looking for is a report on any bugs you come across. Deadline for said report is Sunday evening, sometime-ish. Otherwise, it's a very-near-complete project that has all the gameplay that you can expect from the final version. Playtesting can be fun, honest! :3

=======

Everybody else: expect final sexy game on Monday.

Nandrew
20-09-2009, 01:47 PM
Just a quick note to playtesters: if I'm to use your feedback, I'd like it by sometime this evening at latest so that I can wrap everything up for tomorrow.

In addition to bug hunts, I've actually gone against my own firm resolution to not fiddle with the game more and have been involved in a few more balancing tweaks. It appears that the Move skill is far too powerful, and Track goes under-used.

So if you have the inclination, tell me your top scores from your testing sessions! For bonus points, tell me HOW you got 'em.

---------------

A few quick balance notes about changes that will be made in the FINAL final game:

- Tracking skill now increases the score harvest from enemies by 15% per level. THAT should make it quite useful.
- Regeneration skill now increases the maximum health cap by 20 per level.
- Mobile OS item has been nerfed to +50%
- looping code has been buffed (10% gain per kill)
- Defender has been buffed to 2 damage resistance
- Firewall buffed to 45 points
- Chunk the Zombie now provides a 1000 score discovery bonus (first time) and is far more useful in general
- Charger buffed to +50
- Final shock buffed to +100 per enemy

--------------

I also remember a question from earlier, regarding the stacking of item effects like volatile file and looping code. The answer: stacking is done in series, not in parallel. This can become quite generous:

Basic enemy: 100 SCORE
+45% tracking: 100*1.45 = 145 SCORE
+50% roomfeel: 145 * 1.5 = 217.5 SCORE
+50% volatile file: 217*1.5 = 326.25 SCORE
+100% while loop (after ten enemies): 326.25*2= 652.5 SCORE

Final result (floored):
652 SCORE

vs

Original:
100 SCORE

Maths is awesome.

Nandrew
21-09-2009, 04:41 PM
The final version of Onslaught of the Electric Zombies has just gone live! Check the first post for details and a download.

Thanks to everybody who contributed to this project with their feedback and suggestions. Thanks also to those undercover buggers who helped me bug-hunt and balance over this final weekend. The electric zombies all salute you in their own haphazard, undead way.

herman.tulleken
22-09-2009, 09:29 AM
Hi,

Haven't had a chance yet to play it properly yet; just did a quick play-through last night. So far it looks great!

I did stumble on what looks like a bug though: in the last level, I used the item that wipes all enemies, which it did, except for those zombies that duplicate when you kill them (can't remember what they are called). This was a bit annoying, because I did not have lot's of energy, and used it so that I could clear the level...

Anyways, will play it thoroughly very soon.

ht

Nandrew
22-09-2009, 11:37 AM
Oh, knowing the nature of the last level, that won't quite work. :P

For those not yet in the loop: a new "final scenario" in this version is a horde of duplicating zombies who steadily take over the board. A new zombie is spawned somewhere EVERY TIME you make a move.

Using stealth tech to clear the board is somewhat effective -- it genuinely does remove all existing enemies -- but due to the nature of this level, they'll start replacing themselves from the next movement onward. A prudent player can effectively half their opposition in this case, but not destroy it entirely.

I worded the item description very carefully to allow for this. ;)

dislekcia
22-09-2009, 03:03 PM
Last night I got the most hax movement score ever: Had the item that adds half the damage of the last zombie you killed plus the googlebot and a scrambler. Pwnt the zombie king and cleaned out the rest of the level for 74 points a square :)

herman.tulleken
22-09-2009, 03:34 PM
Oh, knowing the nature of the last level, that won't quite work. :P

Using stealth tech to clear the board is somewhat effective -- it genuinely does remove all existing enemies -- but due to the nature of this level, they'll start replacing themselves from the next movement onward. A prudent player can effectively half their opposition in this case, but not destroy it entirely.

I worded the item description very carefully to allow for this. ;)

OK, that makes sense... I really must learn to read :-)

ht

Nandrew
22-09-2009, 04:43 PM
Haha, no problem, I just kept it in there so that I could defend myself from players raising their eyebrows. :P


Last night I got the most hax movement score ever: Had the item that adds half the damage of the last zombie you killed plus the googlebot and a scrambler. Pwnt the zombie king and cleaned out the rest of the level for 74 points a square :)

I've not managed to do that myself yet, but it's precisely what I redesigned the item for. :P Nice catch!

Literally the only way that particular combo could be more hax is if you happened to have Mobile OS in your inventory as well, since the score bonuses stack geometrically! ;) Anybody who manages to get that full item combo in-game should tell us about it, because I imagine the scores could start getting pretty seriously sick.

There's a combat-focused combo which harvests final-level score too, though I'll leave that up to the players to figure out. :P

Nandrew
23-09-2009, 04:35 PM
Right, just two things:



(1) This morning, I was screwing around with the game and narrowly missed out on a Cybergod rating for the Long session (got about 120k). Stupidly enough, I died on the very last block of the very last level because I got clumsy, and lost out on the 30% score bonus. D'oh.

My point: I think I've got it balanced so that a Cybergod rating is much more difficult to achieve, both in Short and Long mode. Can you prove me wrong? Do we have any impressive score totals out there that warrant some attention?

Post me a convincing score (either short or long) and your name will go up in lights on the first post. Yeah, it's not the most glorious of glory things, but it would be really nice to give new players and download-seekers some perspective. That, and you have bragging rights. Screenshots and descriptions of your game build are welcome.


(2) The first post is now fully up and armed with all the marketing stuff for Comp 23. In particular, if you like the game, please become a fan on Facebook! It helps me keep track of generally sorta how well it's doing. That, and there's the potential for discussions and reviews and all that other muck once I figure out how a fan page works. Or Facebook, for that matter. Damn Facebook.

dislekcia
23-09-2009, 05:00 PM
I've seen quite a few GM global high score things around teh webzor, any chance of adding in something like that? Could be a good idea:

All time top scores, last day, last week.

Nandrew
23-09-2009, 05:27 PM
I'll look that up. For now, it's the crude submit-your-score-please method. :P

Oh, and that brings up a pretty good point: everybody should note that version 1 isn't the end, so to speak. It's just the first "official" release. Heck, I've got loads more numbers to pull out if it looks like we need improvements. Such as a global high-score list.

And unicorns.

herman.tulleken
23-09-2009, 05:40 PM
everybody should note that version 1 isn't the end, so to speak. It's just the first "official" release.
...
And unicorns.

Good ;-)

Brackard
23-09-2009, 06:03 PM
Alrighty,

It seems I've officially been deemed 'worthy' to post. :P

I've played through a couple of times now and some initial thoughts:

I love the monster codex. That prevents me from having to do all the stats myself, thanks for that.

Marauders: I know you nerfed them because of their ability to hit everywhere on the level and when stacked, were unfair at times. I think they might be too UNDER powered now. Unless you just HAPPEN to come into a stack of 3 or 4 in a corner, you're not going to be touched.

You're showing spawning levels at 7,8,10. There's a solid chance that toughness is two by that time, and with the -1 drain, it's just easy score harvesting. Think you should consider pushing them to a -2 drain. I'll need to play a few more times to get a better feeling for it.

The static level: Just plain irritiating. Neat idea, but wow do I hate it.

I REALLY like the behemoth idea. Nicely done there.

On the long game, the zombie king is nearly a given to be defeated. By the time you reach the zombie king, you (should?) have all your slots open and at LEAST one item that can take out the king.

Like the last time around, I'll start some data mining for you and give you some better feedback.

As the 1.0 though, very nice.

-B

Nandrew
23-09-2009, 07:29 PM
Awesome, Brackard! Thanks again for the feedback.

The issues you raise are things that I've been giving some thought to ... and you're right. Marauders, while I personally find them fun to hunt down, are too underpowered now. They rarely have an impact, and I genuinely want players to be rather scared of them. The king also seems to be a tricky customer ... in the short game, he's still pretty tough, but as you've pointed out already, long is a different story.

The amount of feedback and interest I've received from various sources already has encouraged me to start development on version 1.1 to put in some tweaks and extras. Thanks for the continued support, all. :)

Brackard
24-09-2009, 10:20 PM
For the record, beating cybergod takes a HELL of a lot of luck....

Score: 125,062.

Yes, that's 62 points over the bar.

Upgrade track:
MOVE
MOVE
TRACK
MOVE
TRACK
SLOTS
MOVE
SLOTS
TRACK
TOUGH
TOUGH
SLOTS
TOUGH
REGEN
REGEN
REGEN

Key milestones. I pulled the Mobile OS at level 5, so I had to use slots at level 6 to get an item to protect it (so it wouldn't get destroyed). Had to do the same when I received Quarantine at level 7. I did not receive the item that allowed for additional bonuses when you killed monsters which is a slight shame.

I cleared half the levels.

Now to reverse it and see if I can do it with a fighting build.

Nandrew
24-09-2009, 11:04 PM
Nice one on the Cybergod score! Yeah, it's definitely a lot tougher to get to (and can't always be done, even for a good player), but I hope that hitting the rating was satisfying. :)

I'll add your final tally to the unofficial high-score list. Gonna do my best to get the next version out with some proper global high-score listings: it's far more glorious and "official" than the current honour-based system.

Evil_Toaster
25-09-2009, 01:16 AM
Not to mention the scores file being easily editable plain text. ;)

dammit
25-09-2009, 10:53 AM
Seriously, I think I deserve cake for this one :P

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk157/dammit62/winrar.png

Basically: While Loop and Quarantine plus random bonus level = win!

(oh and final level was the multiplying hordes. With the defender and lots of tough, that was like a free for all \o/)

Higushi
25-09-2009, 12:47 PM
Game is legend. Had loads of fun, which, of course, is what this whole game making thing is all about. :P

The way the writing, graphics and sounds come together makes it feel really polished. It's really much more of a lovely experience playing a game that presents itself in such a clean and thoughtful manner. Sweet work guys! :)

Nandrew
25-09-2009, 01:06 PM
Not to mention the scores file being easily editable plain text. ;)

SHUSH YOU!!! :< But yeah, you're right. So like, high scores aren't really going to have integrity until I get a secure submission system going. For now, it's just for fun.



---

Higushi: you've reminded me, actually. I still need to get my silly ol' team members to show up and comment in this thread. They're being way too shy for their own good. <_<

Dammit: sweet! You goes onto teh WALL OF HONOUR(TM)!

Nandrew
25-09-2009, 01:12 PM
Also, due to various stuffs (including rAge expo), I'll be heading up to Gauteng on Sunday evening. Given this situation, I'm thinking of putting up a minor update (v1.01) before the weekend is out so that I can get the global score system and one or two other thinglets done and dusted.

Major content update (v1.02) will probably follow a lil' later when I have more time, and will focus on including some ideas and paradigms that I didn't get to finish for v1. I'm kinda keen to see if I can evolve this game in a way that steers it just a *little* more towards skill, through subtle "nudges" provided by more predictive items and room feelings.

dammit
25-09-2009, 02:42 PM
Dammit: sweet! You goes onto teh WALL OF HONOUR(TM)!

Mah life is complete! \o/

Karuji
25-09-2009, 03:16 PM
While I really enjoy the new challenge of the game (still have yet to reach cybergod :< ) I think that now it is more luck dependant than before.

And while the ol' tough and slots strat doesn't apply anymore. There is sort of set strat to get to the higher scores.

Nandrew
25-09-2009, 04:19 PM
While I really enjoy the new challenge of the game (still have yet to reach cybergod :< ) I think that now it is more luck dependant than before.

And while the ol' tough and slots strat doesn't apply anymore. There is sort of set strat to get to the higher scores.

Right now, I can identify two *general* strats to get high scores, yeah. Though these should be fairly malleable in themselves. I often find that it's impossible to simply say "I'll use this strat" and just stick to it: the game keeps throwing interesting combinations my way during playtests, and I'm usually forced towards adaptive play.

However, I WILL be addressing the "luck vs skill" debate in future versions of the game. It's my current Big Design Issue(TM): there NEEDS to be an element of luck (it's a randomly generated dungeon, after all), but I'm looking at several game additions (mostly items, room feelings and scenarios) which will promote long-term planning and steer it more in the direction of player skill more.

This will be in version 1.02 (aka. Big Content Patch).

Version 1.01, on the other hand, will be focusing on a few minor cleaning jobs and tweaks, AS WELL AS A KICKASS ONLINE SCORE SUBMISSION SYSTEM! \:D/ At the current rate of development, it looks like I'll have it released before the weekend is done -- I've found a nice, simple system that should meet my requirements and I'll be able to scrap the temporary Wall of Honour. ;)

Brackard
25-09-2009, 06:37 PM
Just posted a new high score based off the slots and tough strategy.

Upgrade went:
1 Track
2 Slots
3 Track
4 Tough
5 Tough
6 Tough
7 Track
8 Slots
9 Slots
10 Regen
11 Regen
12 Regen
13 Move
14 Move
15 Move
16 Move

Verification sent to Nandrew, but score topped 160k.

Got defender lvl 1, loop code level 9. Cleared all but 3 levels (battle level, bonus level, and early level). Had several levels where the gelis respawned and milked for score (level 6 - normal but with geli, level 14 swarm). Last level was the geli Zombie Geddon and just walked through all of them.

dammit
25-09-2009, 07:09 PM
Verification sent to Nandrew, but score topped 160k.


I accept this challenge! I will better that score :P

dislekcia
26-09-2009, 03:20 AM
127510

Purposefully tried an "odd" build, going for regen early, slots as needed (whenever I kept an item in reserve), then tracking and move before tough. Got a mobile OS about the time I started pumping move, which helped. Final 2 levels had looping code, farmed gelatinous on 15 (really glad I didn't hit cannibals after) and silicon horde as final level with a firewall - ended on 7 health from nearly full 160. Completed 14 out of the 16 levels - exceptions being the bonus level and one other, nailed the sniper level through smart play... Really tried to play intelligently to see if the random or the skizzles were more important.

Realised that you really should lob 1.2 at Popcap when you're done with it. If they pick it up and give you 6 months to polish, you'll be a very happy dev ;)

-edit- You should start tracking people's "builds" and the levels/items that they encountered. That info would really help you when handling score and balancing later... Could even give people a bit of context when they post a high score: "In comparison, people who got the same items as you posted these scores; People who got the same levels posted these scores..."

Brackard
26-09-2009, 04:41 AM
Yeah, I've actually been tracking builds, scores, and items on a level by level basis for him to use for comparisons (thus the reason I can give my builds per above).

I figured it'd give Nandrew a limited basis for balance comparisons. (what builds work, which ones don't, what's overpowered, etc, etc).

dislekcia
26-09-2009, 01:17 PM
Yeah, I've actually been tracking builds, scores, and items on a level by level basis for him to use for comparisons (thus the reason I can give my builds per above).

I figured it'd give Nandrew a limited basis for balance comparisons. (what builds work, which ones don't, what's overpowered, etc, etc).

Exactly. That seemed really useful, so the game should track it for you ;)

Nandrew
26-09-2009, 03:53 PM
Holy crap, Brackard. I've checked all of those screenshots you sent me: undeniable proof of a score that I didn't expect anybody would ever reach!


-edit- You should start tracking people's "builds" and the levels/items that they encountered. That info would really help you when handling score and balancing later... Could even give people a bit of context when they post a high score: "In comparison, people who got the same items as you posted these scores; People who got the same levels posted these scores..."

I could *partially* implement that idea: Fengol asked me earlier for more detailed end-game analyses, and it's something that I'd like to implement (including something like that delightful awards system that the Worms games have always had going!). So I could give players full feedback on builds and items and stuff, but I'm not sure I could exactly do a comparison system with other players: it would require me to use something other than the pre-fab online score sub systems that I've come across, and, well ... I don't want to sound lazy, but I'm looking at baby steps when it comes to that. ;)

I'm glad to hear that you defeated the snipers through "smart play": there actually IS a certain skill to that level which can make the difference between a full clearance and horrible slaughter. What are your other findings about "intelligent play"? I know we had a chat about this earlier, but can you think of things which would enhance the feeling of skill as opposed to luck? Perhaps more levels which bend the rules in the way that the snipers did?

---

And a general message related to this: yeah, I pretty much welcome ANY feedback which will allow me to do a raw "data harvest": details of builds, the sort of enemies/items you came across, and general tactics implemented in a game to achieve high scores in particular. :)

Karuji
26-09-2009, 11:47 PM
Right now, I can identify two *general* strats to get high scores, yeah. Though these should be fairly malleable in themselves. I often find that it's impossible to simply say "I'll use this strat" and just stick to it: the game keeps throwing interesting combinations my way during playtests, and I'm usually forced towards adaptive play.

Completely agreed. And like I said the old strat has fallen away (mostly).

Personally I rounded it down to three basic principals

1: Move score.

2: Kill score.

3: Survivability.

Now everyone might think I'm having one of my nutty mid-night ramblings, but through all my play throughs, I personally have gotten the best score by going with the move score strat, end getting lucky with an early game mobile OS.

The kill score from creeps is something that in terms of items I haven't had a play through where it panned out correctly. But I personally believe that killing stuff would yield the highest score.

Now the counter point in survivability. Do I go for the extra level of tough or regen so that I can clear out a level, or should I focus on move and slots. This is the adaptive part. I've never gone in with a set start build and come out as I expected (which is what I love about this version). But once again it comes down to a large part of luck.


However, I WILL be addressing the "luck vs skill" debate in future versions of the game. It's my current Big Design Issue(TM): there NEEDS to be an element of luck (it's a randomly generated dungeon, after all), but I'm looking at several game additions (mostly items, room feelings and scenarios) which will promote long-term planning and steer it more in the direction of player skill more.

Ok problem solved lets go eat cake.

And from everything I've read there are creep balances so yay more cake. (Though I'll scratch down my thought on creeps in my next play through there has been something bugging me just can't remember what now)


This will be in version 1.02 (aka. Big Content Patch).

Version 1.01, on the other hand, will be focusing on a few minor cleaning jobs and tweaks, AS WELL AS A KICKASS ONLINE SCORE SUBMISSION SYSTEM! \:D/ At the current rate of development, it looks like I'll have it released before the weekend is done -- I've found a nice, simple system that should meet my requirements and I'll be able to scrap the temporary Wall of Honour. ;)

As far as Wall of Honour? goes. Any plan of trying to stack up the 8 level and the 16 level games? I know it could be the typical apple and orange comparison. But I think it would be rather interesting.

Oh and ^5 to everyone great ideas all round. :)

Nandrew
27-09-2009, 09:07 PM
As far as Wall of Honour™ goes. Any plan of trying to stack up the 8 level and the 16 level games? I know it could be the typical apple and orange comparison. But I think it would be rather interesting.

Oh and ^5 to everyone great ideas all round. :)

I'd prefer keeping the two separate for now. That is, if I understand you correctly when you say "stack up". If I were to try compare scores from the two, it would be more than simply, say, doubling the score for 8-level totals. It would create a balancing challenge that I'm not too keen on delving into: I would much rather focus on improving the current system as opposed to giving myself something new to think about, even though it's a tempting exercise. Crunching these numbers and making these tweaks is actually pretty gosh-darn fun (gawd, that sounds geeky), but it's difficult and time-consuming too.

Anyways. Version 1.1 will be sorted by the end of this evening, out tomorrow at latest. As mentioned before, there won't be many changes aside from online score subs (and a bunch of under-the-hood stuff that you'll rarely notice). I probably should have devved this more quickly, but Saturday got swallowed by journo stuff and today ... er, today was dominated by Flash games. <_<

I'll admit some weakness here, 'cos I totally just got access to some killer wireless Internet which means that I'm actually able to surf with browser images enabled again and generally, like, use the Web. I get a little giddy when this happens. \:D/

Brackard
27-09-2009, 10:39 PM
I notice you are putting these releases out fairly quickly.

I'm not sure what else you have in store for 1.1, but if you want to get some real feedback, you need to give the players/testers some time to really delve into the game before making widespread changes.

Somebody comes up with a killer strategy. Is it REALLY a killer strategy or did someone simply get lucky? Are there other strategies that will mimic the score, or will the min/max crowd end up heading in the same direction to max score?

We won't know until we have some more time. Better yet, if you give us some direction as to what you'd like to SEE tested, we can work that direction as well. It's simply that if we keep changing the game so fast, we'll never REALLY be able to benchmark it to see what REALLY needs to be changed.

Just my .02.

Karuji
27-09-2009, 11:05 PM
I was talking about finding some really mathy, and geeky way to make the scores work on a relative basis. Maths FTW. (Also I think to a large extent the short game is harder as you have a limited set of skills.)

Also Brackard deserves a cake, never mind a cookie, really steller points. And I completely agree with them.

Nandrew
27-09-2009, 11:07 PM
I notice you are putting these releases out fairly quickly.

I'm not sure what else you have in store for 1.1, but if you want to get some real feedback, you need to give the players/testers some time to really delve into the game before making widespread changes.

Somebody comes up with a killer strategy. Is it REALLY a killer strategy or did someone simply get lucky? Are there other strategies that will mimic the score, or will the min/max crowd end up heading in the same direction to max score?

We won't know until we have some more time. Better yet, if you give us some direction as to what you'd like to SEE tested, we can work that direction as well. It's simply that if we keep changing the game so fast, we'll never REALLY be able to benchmark it to see what REALLY needs to be changed.

Just my .02.

Yeah, don't worry: that's why version 1.01 is more of an interface/under the hood release than a rule-changing one. No scores or strategies will be affected: it's really just for people who want a global high score list.

V 1.02, on the other hand, is the content changer. This one will be a bit more "wait and see": I'm not even going to start development on it until after the rAge expo next week ... going to get additional feedback from the community before I do anything rash. ;)

Nandrew
28-09-2009, 03:28 PM
There is a new version available! Grab it from page 1. I really really really hope it's not broken in any way (and it really shouldn't be).

There's two main reasons why you'll probably want to grab it:

(1) Online high scores with GMH (http://gmc.yoyogames.com/index.php?showtopic=417012&st=0). It's a simple system, but it does its job: you can now submit and record your scores on a global leaderboard! I'll consider moving to a more sophisticated framework if this game gets really really really popular but, well, it does a satisfying job for me and I wanna support the guy who made it. :)

(2) You know those little messages that you get at the bottom of the screen while playing? Well, now you can backtrack to a previously-revealed gridblock and re-examine the message you got when you first clicked on it. These "old" messages are fixed to the time you first opened the block though, so be careful about going back and reading them after the environment has changed (HINT: broken tiles are often culprits!). This information is preserved because I don't want the repeat messages to offer any real game advantage: I just know that people like having their memories refreshed. :P

Bear in mind that if the above doesn't interest you, then you don't NEED version 1.01 to have the "up to date" Electric Zombies experience. Version 1.00 will do fine: the enemies are the same, the game rules haven't been tweaked and it is, overall, just as much raw fun. But I'd really appreciate people grabbing this version, playing it and uploading at least one nice score. :)

Have fun, lemme know if there's a crisis.

Brackard
28-09-2009, 05:17 PM
Getting an error trying to load scores:

ERROR in
action number 1
of Mouse Event for Left Released
for object SubmitButton:

Error defining an external function.

**

Hitting ignore, you get this:

ERROR in
action number 1
of Mouse Event for Left Released
for object SubmitButton:

In script SubmitOnline:
Error in code at line 10:
show_debug_message("GMHsubmit:site:" + site);show_debug_message("GMHsubmit:result:" + result);

at position 89: Wrong type of arguments to +.

**

I'm glad it wasn't a score I was proud of. :P

Nandrew
28-09-2009, 06:13 PM
That's very odd, I'm not sure what's happening there. Have you got the netread.dll file? Maybe I did something really stupid and forgot to package it or something.

Gaaah, unfortunately I can't address this problem right now, I'm just about to embark on a bus trip. If anybody else hits this error, could y'all report it to me as well? I'll try to fix everything up tomorrow.

(--EDIT--) I'm wondering if it's related to security settings of some kind, since this is an online access thingie, after all.

dislekcia
28-09-2009, 06:45 PM
Getting an error trying to load scores:

ERROR in
action number 1
of Mouse Event for Left Released
for object SubmitButton:

Error defining an external function.

**

Hitting ignore, you get this:

ERROR in
action number 1
of Mouse Event for Left Released
for object SubmitButton:

In script SubmitOnline:
Error in code at line 10:
show_debug_message("GMHsubmit:site:" + site);show_debug_message("GMHsubmit:result:" + result);

at position 89: Wrong type of arguments to +.

**

I'm glad it wasn't a score I was proud of. :P


That's very odd, I'm not sure what's happening there. Have you got the netread.dll file? Maybe I did something really stupid and forgot to package it or something.

Gaaah, unfortunately I can't address this problem right now, I'm just about to embark on a bus trip. If anybody else hits this error, could y'all report it to me as well? I'll try to fix everything up tomorrow.

(--EDIT--) I'm wondering if it's related to security settings of some kind, since this is an online access thingie, after all.

Nope, it's what happens when you run the game directly out of the zip file ;)

The exe can't find the DLL to link to (because it's not in the same folder) so it borks. You could probably wrap the DLL bind at some point to make the error not crash the game, but people aren't going to be able to submit when playing straight from the zip.

Brackard
28-09-2009, 07:13 PM
Wasn't playing directly out of the zip, but did copy it straight out of the zip, so it's half correct.

Interesting. Alrighty, I'll try it again.

***

And rather than spamming, just noting that it did indeed work.

Thanks!

dislekcia
29-09-2009, 12:20 AM
Wasn't playing directly out of the zip, but did copy it straight out of the zip, so it's half correct.

Interesting. Alrighty, I'll try it again.

***

And rather than spamming, just noting that it did indeed work.

Thanks!

Glad it worked, saved Nandrew a stress aneurysm on the bus ;)

So did that dll over there just not look essential? Time for an installer, methinks...

Brackard
29-09-2009, 12:51 AM
Naw, simply wasn't paying attention.

I did exactly what I did with the previous version. Pulled it out and started playing. There's always a few files Read me, and instructions, but bah, who need that?!?

dislekcia
29-09-2009, 02:15 AM
Naw, simply wasn't paying attention.

I did exactly what I did with the previous version. Pulled it out and started playing. There's always a few files Read me, and instructions, but bah, who need that?!?

Yeah, I know what you mean.

We actually have a pretty strong "readme culture" here, a reaction to loads of prototypes and never being sure what the controls are when you first start a game. Playing hunt and peck to see what does what is only fun for the first few hundred times ;)

Brackard
29-09-2009, 03:17 AM
Consider me properly chastised. I'll be sure to slow down in my enthusiasm to open the newest toy. :P

dislekcia
29-09-2009, 04:04 AM
Consider me properly chastised. I'll be sure to slow down in my enthusiasm to open the newest toy. :P

Heh, the best part about hanging out here is the constant supply of new toys :)

Also, nice score... Wow.

OT: Rage! RAGE at claw chips! ARGH! Had to choose between a defender and a volatile file to give away :( Nooooooooo

Brackard
29-09-2009, 05:51 AM
No, don't get me wrong here. I'm not here just for the toys. I really liked what was being created and figured I could give my .02. If I get irritating, I'm sure someone will kick me out. :P

As to the score, I've got the strategy just about down - i.e. repeatable, but a number of things have to fall into place. This is based on the toughness strategy. I left points on the table too based on a few bad decisions on my part.

I tried the movement strategy earlier today, and had a just about perfect run and didn't come even CLOSE to what you can make with this strategy. Assuming we want multiple viable strategies, I think some adjustments need to be made.

dislekcia
29-09-2009, 12:33 PM
No, don't get me wrong here. I'm not here just for the toys. I really liked what was being created and figured I could give my .02. If I get irritating, I'm sure someone will kick me out. :P

As to the score, I've got the strategy just about down - i.e. repeatable, but a number of things have to fall into place. This is based on the toughness strategy. I left points on the table too based on a few bad decisions on my part.

I tried the movement strategy earlier today, and had a just about perfect run and didn't come even CLOSE to what you can make with this strategy. Assuming we want multiple viable strategies, I think some adjustments need to be made.

Just topped out with a movement strat. Got early quarantine and then looping code a couple levels later. Realised that having looping code means you should target the high value zombies last, so that gave me a lot more score. Had random items that healed/helped after that. Finale was the gelatinous zombie spawnfest, finished on 1 energy and 1 thing left to kill... Only realised I should have been maximising the quarantine instead of clicking in rows on the last few zombies, would have finished the level if I'd thought of that, probably another 2.5k there.

Nandrew
29-09-2009, 03:47 PM
One or two people have noted that the online score system allows several entries under the same name, rather than just recording the highest score of a given user. I have a few reasons for allowing this, but I suppose it does beg the question: do y'all think this is a problem?

In a game like this, I don't think that one person can monopolise all of the top podium positions if it gets sufficiently popular: the luck-based element should mean that players of a similar skill can all get a slice of the pie. And since that's the only issue I can immediately bring to mind, I don't theeeeenk that it'll be too bad?

Do you guys reckon I should switch to another online score system? Or can I keep this one (at least until the game gets more popular)?

Nandrew
29-09-2009, 07:21 PM
After much crying, begging and threatening, I managed to get an updated review on IndieGames:

http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2009/09/update_onslaught_of_the_electr.html

Thanks again, Tim W.

Brackard
29-09-2009, 08:17 PM
New High Score posted.

If I had received the gelatin ending, I could have easily posted a score in the 240-250k range.

I've come to the conclusion it's the equipment you receive that is going to max your score, not whether you work a 'toughness' vs 'movement' strategy.

To maximize your score, you need a few things:
1) You need something that will retain your health, i.e. defender. With max toughness, the jellies can't touch you, or maybe something like harger with a corrupt folder. With a lvl 3 toughness, jellies still can't effectively hurt you.
2) Looping Code. Essential for score.
3) Volatile File. More score bonuses.
4) And probably the most important, you need someway to SEE the jellies, i.e. googlebot or drive scanner. Without this, you can hit SOME, but can't maximize your score.
5) Tracking - you need to be able to eliminate the cannibals (deadly) and stay away form hoarders. (don't need a score drain).

So, with that being said, jellies appear on levels 6, 7, 9, and 15. At levels 6 and 7, you will still be working on your tracking or toughness, so jellies won't maximize THAT much. Even with a defender, you can't maximize it because you really can't see/track them all that well.

At level 9, your setup could look something like:
Tracking: 2
Slots: 3
Toughness: 3

With a 'tad' of luck, you COULD have: Defender + two of looping code, googlebot/drive scanner, volatile file.

Depending on your completeness at that level will determine exactly how well you can milk the level 9 jellies.

Level 15 though, is where you HAVE to make your mark. Use google/scanner to identify the bad guys. Eliminate the cannibals first off. Find your jellies, then chase them around the level. Between your volatile file and Looping code, you will simply watch your score SOAR.

If you are extremely lucky, you'll get to do the same on the VERY NEXT LEVEL. However, you'll probably have used your scanner already, so it will only be 75% as effective. Just make sure you hit the jellies on the final level as opposed to free space. That way, you get two free spaces covered instead of just one.

With a solid two levels covered with the above, 240-250k score is very reasonable. I just got unlucky this time. If you happen to hit the level 9 in there as well....wow....

Nandrew
29-09-2009, 09:12 PM
Thanks, that actually sounds like a very accurate idea of where to go for score ...

I still really like the jellies (heh, nice nickname), but I think I may just nerf their effects in the next version. I don't want them to be the primary score hook, but rather just one of many roads that players can take. It's good that these sort of tactics can be identified like this, it'll help me shape 1.02 when it comes out.

Brackard
29-09-2009, 09:39 PM
I think you can go one of a couple different ways in the beginning (movement strategy is something I will try now in the beginning knowing what I need for end-game) but end-game the way it stands, there just isn't a different strategy that will be competitive.

And yes, I posted the above for your reference. I fully expect (and hope?) that changes would be made to make different approaches competitive. My job is simply to break it for you. :P

Squid
29-09-2009, 11:28 PM
"Unexpected error occurred when running the game."

:(

Nandrew
30-09-2009, 12:08 PM
... that IS unexpected. And a bit difficult to troubleshoot. Where, when and how did this error message crop up? :S

Did you extract all files from the zip?

Squid
30-09-2009, 12:58 PM
Did you extract all files from the zip?

Yep.

I saw the loading image, got given a fancy new .dat file. Then as, the loading finished it bombed out.

Nandrew
30-09-2009, 01:56 PM
Hm. If you got the file, then the program definitely managed to do IO *BEFORE* bombing. I'm still perplexed concerning how this error was triggered, though, as I've been unable to recreate it and GM itself usually provides more specific messages when something goes screwy.

Erm, let's see. First of all, could you try to open the .dat file that was generated? It's just some plaintext (not really fussed about heavy security for offline scores) and should have some rank names and numbers floating around in there.

I'm also wondering if you could give the game one or two more run-throughs, first with the .dat file intact and secondly after you delete the .dat file.

These measures would be greatly appreciated, as they'll hopefully aid the troubleshooting process.

----

People: remind me to implement a log file in version 1.02. These sort of situations tend to get painful. >.<

Squid
30-09-2009, 06:53 PM
Random ZomHacker
1.0000
1.0000
1.0000
0.0000
Cybergod
50000.0000
Tech wizard
40000.0000
Administrator
35000.0000
Cybergod
125000.0000
Tech wizard
100000.0000
Administrator
87500.0000
Cybergod
100000.0000
Tech wizard
75000.0000
Administrator
60000.0000

That's the .dat I get. I tried running it different ways, to no avail. Also, it may be worth noting that I'm running Windows 7.

Nandrew
01-10-2009, 12:22 PM
Long story short: you've helped me catch a bug with the score files. I have no idea whether or not this will affect you, but at least it'll fix up some confusion for other players who get their lower scores wiped occasionally.

Updated download in the first post after a good three hours of fighting with Box.net. <_<

Nandrew
12-10-2009, 01:40 PM
Righto, so, work on version 1.02 is progressing quietly. Mainly because I've been rather ill and cut off this weekend, so I've not been as verbal about progress as I usually am. :P

I do have one question, though. I've been looking at a few of the current items for adjustment (stuff like the looping code and such) but there's one question I'd like to pose to you guys:

One of the current items (ie. exists in v1.01 already) is predictive text. For those not yet aware, it allows you to figure out what the next "level feeling" is before actually going there.

Unfortunately, the structure of the game means that it may have limited use, because you always spend your skill point for the current level before you get to do your scrying. It doesn't seem to promote enough long-term planning, which I imagine would be its natural strength.

What if I got predictive text to list the room effects for the rest of the remaining levels in the game? Or, if that seems too powerful, how about letting it predict the next three or four levels instead of just one? I think it would actually give players more meaningful information.

Does this sound gewd, basically?

herman.tulleken
12-10-2009, 04:09 PM
Does this sound gewd, basically

I think so. (Perhaps you could even randomise the number of levels ahead a bit).

ht

Brackard
12-10-2009, 11:23 PM
I'll admit that the predictive text is a throwaway/safety item for me. I'll use it to protect one of my more 'important' items. I never use it.

The only way I could see that being of use would be say found on levels 3-5 where it predicts the next 3-5 levels. After level 8, you've pretty much established your development for the game so knowledge, while great, is not worth giving up a slot for unless you have an extra, which bring us back to the throwaway/safety item....

Nandrew
13-10-2009, 07:31 PM
Cool, I'll buff it up so that it'll have use in at least a few scenarios.

I'm still trying to figure out when I'll push v 1.02 out. I wanna market 1.01 a bit more first and draw in some potential feedback from extra players, so I'll probably have to get that sorted out first.

monkey66
02-12-2009, 03:19 AM
http://i48.tinypic.com/v76nm1.jpg

I made a bunch of mistakes, but got really lucky with the GoogleBot and the early items.

Nandrew
06-12-2009, 05:43 PM
Awesome! And thanks for the stat list!

Now that some of the other noise in my life has quietened down a bit, I'll be paying proper attention to that all-important 1.02 update (none of these occasional, crappy mini work sessions that seem to define it lately). A largely distraction-free time over the end of year may end up being quite helpful. <_<

BlackShipsFillt
07-12-2009, 10:10 AM
Ooh ooh! Cybergod! (My score didn't seem to submit, but I just passed the 125K mark)

Very nice game... Though I would market it as minesweeper-like... it's more like a rogue-like stealth-math zombie survival game... I'm very impressed with all the gameplay variations this little game achieves, it's one of those endlessly-replayable-perfect-little-games, like Strange Adventures in Infinite Space or Spelunky.