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GeometriX
22-11-2007, 12:09 PM
Hi folks

As some of you may know, I ain't no programmer, so I often get stuck with tons of ideas for making a game and no way to actually put them into practice. With my 3D course nearing its end, and my creative juices burning a hole in the pit of my stomach, I'm very much in that "gotta make a damn game" kinda mood at the moment. A buddy from college and I have decided that because Doom Patrol is just so freakin' awesome, and basically comes packaged with neatly organised assets just begging to be put into a game, it has to be done.

So far, this is still in its early conceptual stage, where we're trying to figure out exactly what we want to do, and what our goals are, but I figure it's never too early to pick the brains of the people who have been doing this whole game dev thing a lot longer than I have.

So, here goes, this is the blurb we came up with:

- Combining action-adventure with puzzle-solving in an isometric, multi-platform environment; guide your choice of characters from the Doom Patrol series through multiple worlds, each with multiple levels for you to explore at your leisure.

- Furious single or two player action, allowing for character switching on-the-fly.

- Unlock each character's backstory to access new weapons, new powers, and even new playable characters.

- In-the-field upgrades and ammo types (pickups) allow for customised weapons and powers through the powerful gene reassignment system. Some pickups are universal and can be combined with each character's powers to yield incredible new results, while other unlocks are character-specific, and will either enhance or extend a character's choice of powers.

- Don't just play each level to kill the final boss! Re-visit levels to gain access to hidden areas when you've unlocked the right tools for the job.

- Say goodbye to linear gameplay! YOU get to choose when and where you deal with situations as they arise. Not in the mood to save the day right now? Spend time honing your skills and practising your power combinations in the former JLA headquarters' hardcore training grounds, or read into the history of the Doom Patrol world that you've unlocked during the game.

-Breath-taking visuals combine lush, hand-painted backgrounds with retro-style environment rendering and expert charcter and environment animation, bring the world of Doom Patrol to life!

Basically, think Megaman meets Metal Slug with a dose of classic side-scrolling beat 'em ups. The power-stitching system (on-the-fly switching, enhancing and altering of powers) will be done using a radial menu of some sort, so as to not mess with the pace of a 2-player environment.

Essentially, what we want to achieve, is a side-scrolling action fest with as little classic platform-hopping as possible. We're aiming to mostly remove the annoying, repetitive, lava-jumping-over-bouncing-fireballs-on-the-moving-platform gameplay everyone is used to, and replace that with some intelligent puzzle-solving sequences that are built into the level design from the beginning, as opposed to just being tacked on at the end (which, IMO, typically makes puzzle-solving rather pointless). Careful gameplay balance is going to be the key issue in this game, so we're taking our time, planning the levels and concepts in detail before getting underway with the implementation.

Oh, and for those of you who have absolutely no idea what Doom Patrol is all about: Doom Patrol Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doom_Patrol).

Now, shower me with ideas :D

dislekcia
23-11-2007, 01:27 AM
Sounds... big. To be honest ;)

When I first read through your ideas this morning, the picture that came to mind was something similar to Marvel Ultimate Alliance crossed with Crusader No Remorse: Isometric view, sprite-based game with hacky-slashy-button-mashy controls. At the moment I have a different view, sort of something like Golden Axe meets Metal Slug, is that more in line with what you're aiming for?

Either way, there are a few things you really need to think about:

How are you going to actually make sure the game is non-linear? Comics (thanks for the research-spree on the Doom Patrol BTW, very loony read) are story driven, so your players are probably going to expect a story mechanic pushing them on. You're going to have to think about your non-linear mechanics quite hard. Are you going to emphasise grinding for levels and/or skills so that players need to redo areas or go exploring for good items, skills, etc? Are you going to try for a sandbox approach where player location in the game world controls what they can and cannot achieve in terms of immediate story (like in GTA you have to be at a mission point to trigger a mission, but there are tons of other triggerable events spread around the immediate play area to keep you amused)? How can an essentially linear 2D platformer level be a sandbox? Metroid and Castlevania have good lessons to teach there...

Secondly, I think you're going to have to put a ton of thinking into how the powers and abilities are used in the game and what they do. In Ultimate Alliance (for instance) it felt like the designers literally split powers up into 4 categories and then shoe-horned pretty much most of what each character can do into those categories. The best characters in the game are the ones that feel like they don't fit into this restrictive mold, the ones with some individuality and life. That's going to be very important to get right.

I suggest you try to get hold of every game I've mentioned here if you're keen on taking this idea seriously. It's big, bold and to be done right it's going to need research and learning what worked and didn't and why in the past. Thankfully our research as game designers tends to be rather enjoyable ;)

-D

Thaumaturge
23-11-2007, 01:28 AM
I think that a superhero-based game of this sort could be fun. ^_^

What Doom Patrol assets are those that you mention as being available, if I may ask?

As to the puzzles, one type of puzzle that I would suggest (although you may well have already thought of this) is one that requires a combination of powers - either having a particular character mix certain powers within themselves, or having two players combine powers on an obstacle in some creative way (such as using a telekinesis power and a matter creation power to create a bridge across a chasm, as a simple example).


- Don't just play each level to kill the final boss! Re-visit levels to gain access to hidden areas when you've unlocked the right tools for the job.

This can, I think, be done well, but please do be careful with it: too much backtracking through empty levels (or worse, for me at least, levels re-populated with the same monsters as had been previously present) to find a single side-quest can be boring - or at least, so I seem to find.

If you want to use back-tracking, make changes to the levels on subsequent visits - I suggest doing one or more of: adding creatures that were not there previously, creating new walls, obstacles and puzzles and opening up new routes. I would also suggest that no single backtrack call for travel through more than one or two previously-visited levels.

Finally, I am a little concerned about the potential problems of using copyrighted IP - has Doom Patrol been released to the public domain, or do they allow fan-games to be made? Even freeware can, I believe, run into problems with the use of copyrighted intellectual property...

You could, of course, always create a superhero game that involves a group very much like the Doom Patrol, but which uses different names and actual characters (and of course which does not use other copyrighted elements of the world in which Doom Patrol is set).

GeometriX
23-11-2007, 10:08 AM
Thanks for the comments and suggestions guys.

Firstly, Golden Axe meets Metal Slug is pretty much the idea I'm going for. There will be button-mashy-combo attacks to a certain degree, but nothing as involved as even Ultimate Alliance.

As for the non-linear approach; my basic plan is to have missions come in two types: critical (story) missions, and extra missions. The story missions will be the worlds ("Books"), each divided into levels ("Issues"), but you'll be able to pull out at any time, and return to the start of whichever level you were on before. Story worlds will be almost completely open right from the start, Megaman style, so there will be certain identifiable bad guys, and it's up to Doom Patrol to take care of them, at their leisure. There'll be an ultimate bad guy world right at the end, which will only be unlocked once you've completed all the story worlds.

Extra missions will be pre-determined, single levels - they will always be optional, and the unlocks found in them will never be required to complete the game. The pre-determined missions will become available at certain points in the story mode (like speaking to a person who asks you to rescue someone, for example). To slightly increase the game's replayability, they'll have random elements thrown in, such as enemies and pickups. There'll be two unlocks at the end of the level - a random backstory, and a fixed power/upgrade.

You'll always be able to return to any level, the enemies will not respawn, but you'll often come back to get to a new part of the level, which will be populated by baddies.

With regards to the powers, I totally agree. I want to avoid pigeon-holing the characters' abilities as much as possible, especially Crazy Jane's. Sure - there will be powers that fire projecticles that cause damage, and powers that increase melee damage, and the usual stuff - but Doom Patrol pretty much guarantees that I can't get lazy with the powers, since they're quite unique compared to other comics.

I've played all the games you've mentioned Dis - most of them quite extensively during my childhood, each one is playing its role in inspiring me to make this game. There's also another game, can't remember its name - sorta Japanese style platform game, 2-player, where you have two power slots to combine and make a cool weapon, like fire+following gives you a flamethrower that will follow enemies. Ugh, if I remember the name, I'll be sure to mention it. Yes, the game does sound quite big, but I'm going to take my time with this, and make sure it sounds solid before I even open GM.

As for the assets, I meant conceptual assets, not graphics or anything. They're incredibly well organised right from the start, which means I can easily identify powers and abilities, almost totally without ambiguity.

Yeah, I'm a little worried about the IP, but my first goal is to get a playable demo of at least 2 levels, as well as mapping out the entire story. Once that's done, I'll tackle the legal issues. If it comes to the crunch, I certainly will change a few things round, and make a game "Inspired by Grant Morrison".

Nice ideas for the puzzles Thaumaturge, I'll be sure to include them :P

Thaumaturge
24-11-2007, 02:37 AM
The picture is rather clearer in my mind now, I believe - and I rather like it. I very much hope that you fulfil your vision for this game, as I think that it could be rather good. ^_^

luenardi
05-01-2008, 11:43 PM
dude sound good if want to get shaders going in game maker look at this site

http://ultimate3d.org

good forum too!

GeometriX
06-01-2008, 08:46 PM
Wow, nice find dude. Thanks :)

Gazza_N
06-01-2008, 09:19 PM
The concept looks really good, Geo. I like the nonlinearity you're going for, it should keep things interesting, and adds awesome replay value.

I hopes muchly for a demo of some sort.



dude sound good if want to get shaders going in game maker look at this site

http://ultimate3d.org

good forum too!

0_o

I'm in love.