View Full Version : 19: Soul Eater/Reaper/Monger
Smiley
04-06-2008, 01:37 PM
Soul-Reaper/Monger/Eater
Hope i don't f' this up like i have others.
GENERAL GAME IDEA
The game will be a sidescrolling 2D platformer. The characters are typical soldiers called Soul Eaters/Mongers/Reapers with the ability to absorb souls, these souls are the players! The player is a soul and can take control of a host character, to do this the player will need to search for an empty host and take control of it with a simple mouse click(or whatever) once in range. These souls play an important part in the game because they represent life and every soul has hitpoints so when a character is attacked the leech souls hitpoints diminish.
The characters can store a maximum of 7(default) souls in a special cache.When a character is attacked and the controlling souls HP is at 0 that soul is forcibly jettisoned from the host. And the next soul in the cache will take over controlling the character if there are no soul left in the cache the final controlling soul (player itself) is jettisoned and given a minimal fixed HP points to live on until it finds a dormant host. I am thinking the soul be jettisoned in a random direction which can result in the player being left in a tricky situation. But the player can avoid such a situation by forcibly extracting himself from the host and finding a new host. Btw once a players soul is jettisoned a time restriction of 10 seconds is set for that soul and it's previous host for obvious reasons but for forcibly jettisoned souls the restriction is 5 seconds.
A player acquires a soul by killing off another player, but collecting that souls is no meager task. The characters have a device for collecting souls (i originally thought moving over the souls would be best but, a vaccum device with leaves you vulnarable is so much sweeter and creates tension).
When the player's soul is captured the player can respawn with a new soul and character( I am trying to push the respawn idea a little further like, maybe the player could click on a vacant soul and take it over or follow the character which consumed it last and if that character is destroyed (will explain destroying characters now-now) ) re-take control of that souls ( but what reason would he have to do this? Soul experience? Like the longer a souls is used the more accurate it shoots or something ).
Btw souls in the cache heal themselves and regain HP, so do floating hosts(souls with no host). Another twist to this is that floating souls heal much faster than cached souls, so guarding them for a while may be better than capturing them immediately.
WEAPONS
Basic FPS shooter weapons, guns, bombs( direct hits destroy a character and his soul cache meaning all stored souls will be dispersed (much do the delight of anyone nearby :) ) ). Am considering melle combat, but i never really liked the idea of killing off a guy with a single drop kick or knife slash. It's just unrealistic but i may do it anyway cause it's cool and takes courage.
ISSUES
To prevent the issue of too many souls being introduced into the world due to too many respawn of new souls, the player can absorb floating souls past his limit of 7. When these extras are absorbed their hitpoints are transferred to the controlling soul which will prove troublesome for someone latching on to a soul due to it's experience. So the experience idea does not fly from my view.
There is another idea which contradicts another involving respawning by clicking on a floating soul. (that would suck for someone guarding them) So i am considering alternatives here.
FINAL NOTE
There are other loop holes i am looking at which will be addressed. I am working on a Tech-Man, which will iron out most creases in the idea. Devoted this week to that so actual coding will only start over the weekend.
Lol, the idea came out of nowhere yesterday while in the shower(i kid you not :D) So am gonna go at this full throttle!
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<edit> The whole idea screams multiplayer but i am going for a single player experience and hopefully intergrate multiplayer later.
---------------- UPDATE 1 -------------------
Soul Reaper - 1 (http://www.gamedev.za.net/filecloset/data/files/519/Soul_Reaper_-_1.rar)
[A - D] Left and right
[Left Shift] Run
[Left mouse button] Shoot
[0 > 9 ] change weapon
[Issue] The game seems to have a timing issue - I tested it on my laptop and desktop. On the desktop it runs smoothly and on the laptop it runs much faster! Please tell me how it runs on your computer. The shotgun shoots a round every second on my PC, but shoots every half a second on my laptop-the character moves twice as fast too! Just tell me how long it takes on your PC.
[Note] Will work on the characters attire, he's nekkid!
Bonezmann
04-06-2008, 08:15 PM
Lol, the idea came out of nowhere yesterday while in the shower(i kid you not ) So am gonna go at this full throttle!
Gotta love them epiphanies. :)
I came with "Pea My Love" as an epiphany too, and it wasn't a bad game.
This game sounds pretty cool, I may be slow again so please explain the following to me:
in one part you write:
WEAPONS
Basic FPS shooter weapons
but at the beginning you wrote:
The game will be a sidescrolling 2D platformer
Like I said, I may be on the slow side again(It's what happens when you wait the whole damn day in a line at the traffic department) :)
Smiley
05-06-2008, 01:08 AM
Ever played Soldat (www.soldat.pl)? Thats what i am aiming for, but with the obvious twist.
Ya, weapons will comprise of the typical variety found in FPS games. I was not really sure what to call it, a 2D sidescrolling platform shooter... 'em up?
Thaumaturge
05-06-2008, 02:44 AM
As I understand your description, it sounds as though it could be a fun game. ^_^
Let me see if I understand you correctly:
Essentially, you souls are player avatars, albeit interchangeable ones, while hosts are vehicles for souls. When "driving" a host, the player is essentially driving it via one of the souls housed at that time in the host, switching souls as souls are ejected from the host in combat; if the ejected soul is the last, however, the player has no new soul to which to move, and so is ejected with that soul, and still in control of the soul. From what you say, the player has at least some degree of locomotion while controlling only a soul.
If I'm correct in all of that, I have a few questions:
If a player is currently ex-host, controlling only a soul, and all hosts are at that point ensouled, is there any way for the player to gain one of those hosts? Some way of forcing out other souls while in soul-mode, perhaps, or some low-damage weapon? Otherwise, does that player just wait? If so, might this not be a problem given the fairly short amount of time that a player is allowed to stay outside of a host? Might a player not end up "dying" repeatedly in soul-mode for want of a free and sufficiently-near host?
Is there any way to tell different souls apart (even it it's just an XP meter)? If not, then you might want to leave out soul experience, as one might find it too easy to lose a particular desired soul amongst others.
Am I correct in thinking that the hosts themselves are indestructible? If I were to stand there blasting an empty host, would anything happen to it? (Hmm... This could allow a sort of spawn camping, depending on the number of empty hosts at the time...)
... once a players soul is jettisoned a time restriction of 10 seconds is set for that soul and it's previous host for obvious reasons ...
Um... I'm afraid that I don't see it - why is that, if I may ask? ^^;
As to weapons, I'd recommend that you stick with either melee or ranged weapons, but not both; weapons aren't the reason for the game, if I understand your motivation correctly, but rather an enabler of the gameplay. Implementing both weapon types might result in more time being taken (depending on the implementation - with care you might be able to get away with implementing melee weapons as very short-ranged ranged weapons) in a competition with fairly limited time available, it seems to me. In other words, focus on the core and point behind the game. ;)
I was not really sure what to call it, a 2D sidescrolling platform shooter... 'em up?
That's pretty much what I'm inclined to call it: a 2D side-scrolling platformer shoot-'em-up. ^_^
This could indeed be interesting... How big a project do you anticipate this being, if I may ask?
Smiley
05-06-2008, 04:16 AM
If a player is currently ex-host, controlling only a soul, and all hosts are at that point ensouled, is there any way for the player to gain one of those hosts? Some way of forcing out other souls while in soul-mode, perhaps, or some low-damage weapon?
While in soul mode the player is completely vulnerable! The only edge he has over someone with a host is that the souls movements are slightly faster. So as soon as you loose a host you had better high tail it out of there! While in soul mode the player cannot attack other souls (Though this might be a good idea, leading to more game modes
( i will consider it, thanks ) ).
Otherwise, does that player just wait? If so, might this not be a problem given the fairly short amount of time that a player is allowed to stay outside of a host? Might a player not end up "dying" repeatedly in soul-mode for want of a free and sufficiently-near host?
The player is not forced to remain in soul mode, nor is there a time limit for being in soul more, if he/she feels like it he can forfeit the soul and respawn with a fresh soul and host, thats why i was thinking of the whole soul experiece thing to force the player into sticking with the souland searching for a host rather than respawnig. Which could lead to some interesting moments. ;).
I have considered the idea of spawning as a soul then searching fo a host each time but this i feel will be troublesome, but can be set as a separate game mode.
Is there any way to tell different souls apart (even it it's just an XP meter)? If not, then you might want to leave out soul experience, as one might find it too easy to lose a particular desired soul amongst others.
Souls are transperant to everyone but their owner, so absorbing a souls with 9000 XP points would be no different from one with 1. This is to keep a form of balance.
Am I correct in thinking that the hosts themselves are indestructible? If I were to stand there blasting an empty host, would anything happen to it? (Hmm... This could allow a sort of spawn camping, depending on the number of empty hosts at the time...)
Host's are destructable by explosives, grenades, rpg's, anything that makes a big bang! But rifles and general firearms and automatic weaponry will not kill off a host. Hmmm... but this may prove problematic for someone who has acqured a bounty of souls only to have all his souls taken by a lucky shot from a guy named poopy-mc'poop! Gamers are crybabies after all, lol. So it may be best if something else takes the damage, like the stored souls in the cache? *Puts in thinking cap*
Um... I'm afraid that I don't see it - why is that, if I may ask? ^^;
Ok, say a player is in a heap of trouble from ranged attacks coming in from all over the place! He jumps out of the host to avoid the onslaught! (Since his soul is no longer bound to the host - the bullets will wiz thruogh him) Get where i am going with this? The time limit is a bit harsh though, should decrease it.
As to weapons, I'd recommend that you stick with either melee or ranged weapons, but not both; weapons aren't the reason for the game, if I understand your motivation correctly, but rather an enabler of the gameplay. Implementing both weapon types might result in more time being taken (depending on the implementation - with care you might be able to get away with implementing melee weapons as very short-ranged ranged weapons) in a competition with fairly limited time available, it seems to me. In other words, focus on the core and point behind the game.
Thanks for the advice, much appreciated! I am definitely not adding anything more to what is already promised. It's getting big fast.
This could indeed be interesting... How big a project do you anticipate this being, if I may ask?
It's actually not that big at the moment, All thats needed for a platformer is a good solid ground base! (Will get started on this over the weekend) Once you have that all the rest falls into place. I still have not started the Technical Manual which will reveal the full breadth of the project. So maybe i am underestimating it.
I hope i answered all your questions. Just say if i left something out. Thanks again for your input.
Thaumaturge
05-06-2008, 05:24 AM
Aah, you have explained much - thank you. ^_^
Ok, say a player is in a heap of trouble from ranged attacks coming in from all over the place! He jumps out of the host to avoid the onslaught!
Fair enough... but then again, while outside a host you don't get to fire back, and the host is available for possession by others - so jumping out of a host seems to me to already be a risky proposition, and perhaps the more so the longer you stay outside of your host. I haven't examined your game balance in depth, but it looks to me as though that should balance the benefits of avoiding the damage, especially since the host is vulnerable to explosives and the like, and could thus be destroyed completely before the player manages to get back into it to pilot it away.
Souls are transperant to everyone but their owner,
Do you mean that they're invisible, or that their attributes aren't visible? If they're invisible, then how do you know for how long to attempt to gather souls after dealing with an opponent?
Thanks again for your input.
My pleasure. ^_^
Smiley
05-06-2008, 07:06 AM
Fair enough... but then again, while outside a host you don't get to fire back, and the host is available for possession by others - so jumping out of a host seems to me to already be a risky proposition, and perhaps the more so the longer you stay outside of your host.
Imagine this scenario. Remember that your enemies are themselves enemies of each other in a deathmatch! Tom thinks:“Ey' lemme bag that there soul there!” , Edward: “I don't think so bitch!” *Bang!* *bang!* bang!*. Edward wonders as he bags Tom: *Erm... where'd that other soul go?* I reckon it'd be preety risky for a player to go after a soul surrounded by a hail of bullets. Don't you agree? This should give the soul time to escape, if the setting is convinient enough ofcourse. That'd be a good strategy for survival - Remember any sustained damage heals faster while in soul mode. Another strategy i could imaginge is people willingly leaving their host for the sake of regaining hp faster. That'd be a sweet strategy too.
I haven't examined your game balance in depth, but it looks to me as though that should balance the benefits of avoiding the damage...
I'd assume most concepts would tend to be unbalanced, trying to add anything cool that comes to mind and all that. Like i said, i will mull it over, and iron out the creases.
...especially since the host is vulnerable to explosives and the like, and could thus be destroyed completely before the player manages to get back into it to pilot it away.Well it's the players responsibility to be aware of the dangers of his surrounding is it not? I believe you are familiar with the term “Spawn Kill”, would you call that balanced? Personally i don't! I am not quite sure if this lends well with my argument, it just dawned on me.
Do you mean that they're invisible, or that their attributes aren't visible? If they're invisible, then how do you know for how long to attempt to gather souls after dealing with an opponent?They are visible. I meant a souls is just a soul to the one that captures it, it will simply be added to the cache. It has no experience value it simply serves as a spare to cheat death, the core feature of the game. It opens up a hole list of in-game achievements. Most Souls Absorbed, Longest kept souls, longest kept full cache etcetera! I plan on making all of these deciding factors in calculating the victor. Or i could just go with the traditional most kills or whatsoever.
Thanks again for your thoughts and oppinion. All is appreciated and none is lost, if you or anyone else feels anything amiss you know what to do. :).
Thaumaturge
05-06-2008, 08:41 PM
While it may be true that not all games are balanced, that doesn't mean that it's not something to at least aim for. ;)
In this case, you're right that having souls recover hitpoints faster while outside of a host makes leaving the host more attractive. However, instead of discouraging exits from the host by limiting the soul's time outside of a given host, why not simply remove this advantage, or at least reduce it?
Finally, if I may offer an example of my own: ;)
Tom is a pretty good player, and is especially skilled a dodging the slightly slower explosive weapons (I'm assuming that there are explosive weapons that are slower than bullets; if not, then fair enough). Edward has him pinned with heavy gunfire, and Tom is quickly losing health. In order to regroup a bit, and perhaps regain some health, or at least avoid further loss, Tom jumps out of his host.
"Aha!" Thinks Edward, "I have you now!"
With that, Edward whips out a rocket launcher - the rocket of which Tom should easily be able to dodge. But Tom isn't inside his host right now. The rocket fires, a trail of smoke streaking through the air. Tom rushes back towards his body. But such dodges take place so quickly - there's no time left. Tom's host explodes violently, depriving him of any host, and thus the means to fight back for now (and perhaps points?).
In short, I think that, properly balanced, jumping from one's body could become both potentially risky and potentially rewarding, depending on when and how it's used. This sounds to me like a good thing, and I don't think that it necessarily calls for additional features, such as the timer. ;)
dislekcia
06-06-2008, 12:31 AM
In short, I think that, properly balanced, jumping from one's body could become both potentially risky and potentially rewarding, depending on when and how it's used. This sounds to me like a good thing, and I don't think that it necessarily calls for additional features, such as the timer. ;)
Have you played Prey multiplayer at all?
-D
Thaumaturge
06-06-2008, 12:35 AM
Nope - I think that I remember correctly in thinking that it was one of the games that I looked at that my computer would have little hope at all of running successfully, single player or multiplayer. ^^;
dislekcia
06-06-2008, 03:13 AM
Nope - I think that I remember correctly in thinking that it was one of the games that I looked at that my computer would have little hope at all of running successfully, single player or multiplayer. ^^;
Read up on it. They had a spirit-walking mechanic that was implemented very well.
-D
Thaumaturge
06-06-2008, 04:48 AM
It seems, after what at least felt like quite a bit of searching, that not many articles went into much depth on the multiplayer aspect of the game, and of those that did, few mentioned Spirit Walking's application in multiplayer to any great degree.
I do believe that I got an impression, however, which was to some degree confirmed by a slightly more informative description that I found in one review (I think that it was).
From what I gather, in Prey's multiplayer, Spirit Walking allows you to pilot your spirit form, which is invulnerable, but which can deal damage, making you a strong attacker. However, you don't see what becomes of your body - another player might come along, find it, and kill it, killing you with it.
Is that accurate?
Smiley
06-06-2008, 10:18 AM
While it may be true that not all games are balanced, that doesn't mean that it's not something to at least aim for.
I do aim for that.
In short, I think that, properly balanced, jumping from one's body could become both potentially risky and potentially rewarding, depending on when and how it's used. This sounds to me like a good thing, and I don't think that it necessarily calls for additional features, such as the timer.
You make oodles of sense there, i think i will exclude the timer... the idea was more of a whim that carefully thought out in the first place.
Thanks again. :)
Chippit
06-06-2008, 11:35 AM
It seems, after what at least felt like quite a bit of searching, that not many articles went into much depth on the multiplayer aspect of the game, and of those that did, few mentioned Spirit Walking's application in multiplayer to any great degree.
I do believe that I got an impression, however, which was to some degree confirmed by a slightly more informative description that I found in one review (I think that it was).
From what I gather, in Prey's multiplayer, Spirit Walking allows you to pilot your spirit form, which is invulnerable, but which can deal damage, making you a strong attacker. However, you don't see what becomes of your body - another player might come along, find it, and kill it, killing you with it.
Is that accurate?
Sounds about right. As far as I recall, though, spirits may harm each other. So you're invulnerable to most attacks, but not other player's spirit bows.
Thaumaturge
06-06-2008, 06:43 PM
You make oodles of sense there, i think i will exclude the timer... the idea was more of a whim that carefully thought out in the first place.
Thanks again.
Good good, and my pleasure. ^_^
Sounds about right. As far as I recall, though, spirits may harm each other. So you're invulnerable to most attacks, but not other player's spirit bows.
Aah, fair enough - so not quite invulnerable, but nevertheless powerful against corporeal foes. Countering by spirit-walking would be pretty risky, as your body would be left very vulnerable, especially if you were to do so with other corporeal players about.
Chippit
06-06-2008, 06:52 PM
Aah, fair enough - so not quite invulnerable, but nevertheless powerful against corporeal foes. Countering by spirit-walking would be pretty risky, as your body would be left very vulnerable, especially if you were to do so with other corporeal players about.
Exactly. Actually, I was surprised that Prey multiplayer didn't pick up much. The spiritwalking together with the portals and gravity tricks resulted in a game that it was genuinely fresh and new in multiplayer.
EDIT: Apologies, however. I seem to be derailing this thread.
Smiley
09-06-2008, 09:00 PM
Gun/firearm sprites are really troublesome! Is there a website where i could get these for free? Or would it be considered copyright infringement if i resize an actual image touch up the pixels and make it look nice? I already checked the resource page but found nothing.
Sorry not much to show off, yet...
Thaumaturge
09-06-2008, 09:23 PM
Have you tried the links in the resource thread? If so, then have a look over here (http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=272386) - I don't know that you'll find what you're looking for there, but it might well be worth a look. ^_^
As to the copyright concern, I'm not a lawyer, of course, but I think that, in at least some cases, the company that owns the item might own the rights to the depiction of that item. How common this is I don't know - I'd guess that it may only apply to well-known and/or expensive items.
I do seem to recall hearing, however. of games using altered versions of real weapons (that is, models that look similar, but which are sufficiently different) in order to avoid such concerns, if I'm not much mistaken.
Smiley
09-06-2008, 09:57 PM
Well a lot of games are released which depict real life weapons and i don't see no *insert name of weapons manufacturer here* logos and whatnot in the credits. Hypothetically speaking, if i had an M16A2 Automatic rifle. Take a few snapshots, resize it add a cartoony feel to the edges, perhaps edit some colors here and there. Would i be in the wrong here? I did this to a "SPECIAL OPERATIONS COMBAT ASSAULT RIFLE" The SCAR-H, yes it's real, and it looks hawt! So i figured it'd best if i ask here before proceeding any further.
lol, was about to say your link is broken :P
Thaumaturge
09-06-2008, 11:00 PM
I think that, barring cases in which the developers or publishers paid the owners of the weapons, I suspect that you'll find that the weapons are slightly different to the original versions, and, depending on the names used, might have similar but different names. (I think, however, that one is allowed to use the American-government-issued designations (I don't know about those of other governments). You may find that in games the military designations are more common than those of the original manufacturers.)
There may be exceptions to this, of course, and I may well be off in my understanding, but that is as I understand it.
Similarly, the degree to which this applies may depend on the weapon (or other item). A very-little-known weapon might not be a problem (although it might pay to play it safe).
Of course, if you don't expect your game to become particularly big, it's probably not a serious issue. That said, it's probably not a bad idea to get into the habit of being at least fairly copyright/trademark/etc.-safe. ^_^
As to the link, that's odd - it seems to work on my end. o_0
(Unless you attempted to access it in the minutes after I first posted, when it wasn't present. ^^; )
Smiley
09-06-2008, 11:42 PM
I think that, barring cases in which the developers or publishers paid the owners of the weapons, I suspect that you'll find that the weapons are slightly different to the original versions, and, depending on the names used, might have similar but different names. (I think, however, that one is allowed to use the American-government-issued designations (I don't know about those of other governments). You may find that in games the military designations are more common than those of the original manufacturers.)
Right, will rename the SCAR-H to the SCRATCH-H then it'll be fine! lol. I think i will investigate this a little further, hopefully it's no big deal.
That said, it's probably not a bad idea to get into the habit of being at least fairly copyright/trademark/etc.-safe. ^_^
True that. Thanks! :)
As to the link, that's odd - it seems to work on my end. o_0
(Unless you attempted to access it in the minutes after I first posted, when it wasn't present. ^^; )
Yup, thats what i did. ;)
Thaumaturge
10-06-2008, 01:52 AM
I think i will investigate this a little further, hopefully it's no big deal.
I'm glad to hear it. ^_^
Two places that I'd recommend searching are GameDev.Net (http://www.gamedev.net/) (in particular "The Business of Game Development" sub-forum, although I'd recommend a site search and perhaps a perusal of their resource sections (available via the menu at the top)) and Gamasutra (http://www.gamasutra.com/).
As to the link, that's odd - it seems to work on my end. o_0
(Unless you attempted to access it in the minutes after I first posted, when it wasn't present. ^^; )
Yup, thats what i did.
Aah, fair enough - I take it that it works now, then?
True that. Thanks!
My pleasure. ^_^
dislekcia
11-06-2008, 12:20 AM
Right, will rename the SCAR-H to the SCRATCH-H then it'll be fine! lol. I think i will investigate this a little further, hopefully it's no big deal.
It won't be.
Plus, for now it's a better idea to just use what you have and then change things if there are problems later. Nobody's going to sue you :)
-D
Smiley
25-06-2008, 02:03 AM
Ok, finally... I had a lot on my plate last week and i could not even touch my computer let alone program a game! Programming resumed late last sunday and i have been coding like a mad man since then. It sucks not having the luxury of a game making utility! Just pretend you are reading this a week ago!
I know it's not a lot but it's not nothing, will start working on the level maker today and coding jumping and collision detection without a level is just counter productive in a way. I probably won't finish the game by the due date but i can scramble a playable and half enjoyable prototype by then. I am also considering changing the current library i am using for graphics/sound - Allegro for openGL. I could swear i am loosing frames by the hundreds! Either (A) Allegro is old and decrepit or (B) my programming sucks!
Feedback, i request.
Thaumaturge
27-06-2008, 01:07 AM
I'm glad to hear that you're back to programming. ^_^ How is it going?
I haven't used Allegro myself, I'm afraid, but having taken a quick look at its entry on Wikipedia, it's perhaps worth noting that Allegro seems to offer much more features than OpenGL. OpenGL is a graphics API, remember, and so doesn't offer a number of things, such as sound. In order to get those, you would probably end up looking for another toolkit or API. I would also guess that OpenGL is probably a lower-level system than is Allegro, and so I imagine that you'll find that things which are simple in Allegro are less so in OpenGL (although, on the other hand, I would also guess that OpenGL offers more power).
If you want to change tools, perhaps consider something that offers similar functionality. I'm afraid that my knowledge of such things is a tad limited, but others here, or perhaps on other forums, might well be able to help.
Have you looked at SDL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_DirectMedia_Layer)?
That said, however, have you asked around on any forums after the problems that you're having? Perhaps there us a different technique that would improve your game's performance...
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