Thoughts/Questions about Binlor

[The Avatar]

Actually, he works great for a Gnome Spellcaster Assassin...

Also, he may be the easiest to stay with, but you get more mileage on magic damage stuff (Namtar!) if you convert out to get even stronger

[Lujo]

How many walls are there in DI? Getting rid of them through a Binlor Boon or two would open the level (such as it is) up considerably. Low gain, I know, but if it gives MR I'd take the cheap boons and conver out at 50, because a) why not, b) moar exploration and ease of leveling c) magic resists, yay and d) at least 25 piety for "real" worship.

It's not ROFLCOPTER stompage like some levels, but it seems to me like a good thing to have.

Oh, and wouldn't a guaranteed ENDISWALL enable you to kill the subdungeons roadblock and save you the trouble of dealing with 2 Dragon Guardians that way?

[The Avatar]

Yeah, Binlor just wasn't worth it before the update. With the new amount of Stoneskin it'll be great.

[The Avatar]

Binlor might be a bit too good.

My only buys were the gloves of midas (unnecessary fodder) and a Keg of Health (Which went unused). I could have easily gotten Miser

[Lujo]

Told you

Also, the devs said they nerfed DI, but I sort of feel this would've worked even if they didin't.

[The Avatar]

I think the underside is harder, but the Matron is MUCH easier.

[Lujo]

Did you stick with Binlor or converted out?

Come to think of it the entirety of DL difficulty came from the level being claustrophobic denying the ability to cherry pick leveling targets among all the fat (back when it was all-fat). Free ENDISWALL and no walls is about the best prep you could have there...

[Nandrew]

I think I wouldn't mind the mileage that people get out of Binlor if it wasn't so damn easy to do everything from level 1.

That's the only thing that really hasn't been going as intended. Binlor's theme has been to kinda make his followers sweat for piety and make sure that they're consistently earning instead of this easy early-game spiking that's been going on.

I'd like to keep his boons in place, because on their own they seem to be reasonably well-powered. But his piety gain needs to slow down: I'm thinking some diminishing returns on the piety that wall destruction gives you, with the counter being reset per level-up. So ultimately, you'll still be able to get a lot out of Binlor in the long run, but you won't be wall-wiping the whole map before fighting your first monster.

This will make him slightly more demanding of a player's "prayer time", but I think that with a deity this useful it shouldn't be unreasonable to demand longer worship for the full rewards.

[fall_ark]

[Lujo]

Nandrew pretty much summed up my thoughts on Binlor. It's not the boons, but the weird gameplay bypassing that pepping him allows that's the problem. Diminishing returns of some kind on wall destruction has got to be the only way to go about it, really.

Here's a thought:

What if there was a way to get incremental Knockback damage from him, the way you can thake the -res boon? If destroying walls through knockback (or killing monsters using knockback) was a way to go a bout things with Binlor, then you'd link fighting with worshiping him, and make first lvl wall wipes impossible. Along with putting some sort of break on ENDISWAL spam, ofc.