Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONAFYT?

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Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONAFYT?

Postby FDru on Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:17 am

Cause I'm pretty sure there isn't. Hell, even the nerfed APHEELSIK (which is also currently conversion fodder as far as I'm concerned) is good by comparison.

I keep expecting some kind of buff to this spell with each update, but it never comes. Is there really nothing planned for it?
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby Darvin on Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:25 am

Yeah, I really don't see any point to WONAFYT in the current state of the game. Maybe if there were some funky effects in play on the level, but for the base game without any weird going on I really don't see any point.

With the more restrictive inventory space requirements, I've also found the non-repeatable glyphs with low mana costs are quite weak. BYSSEPS and GETINDARE in particular just aren't performing as well as they used to. It's not that they're any weaker, but rather that the inventory space they're vying for is that much more precious and since they aren't as repeatable as glyphs like HALPMEH or as powerful as glyphs like CYDSTEPP they tend to hit the conversion bin much earlier.
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby TigerKnee on Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:56 am

Bysseps wasn't great in the alpha version either actually. Even in that version it was almost always inferior to Halpmeh or even Fireball.

In this version I think its best use is to power up a Strength Potion even more. After that, it's off to conversion bin!
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby q 3 on Tue Nov 08, 2011 6:11 am

One solution might be to combine the two into one glyph: 3 MP gets you +40% attack and first strike (slightly higher attack boost to compensate for the higher MP cost). Or make them repeatable: say, 2 MP for +10% attack but it can be repeatedly cast and the effect stacks (with a reasonable upper limit, certainly no more than +100%, and/or a penalty for casting it a bunch and then regenerating the MP before actually fighting); 3 MP for first strike and another 3 MP lets you bypass the enemy's first strike. Or add secondary effects: 2 MP for +30% attack and the ability to bypass up to, say, 15% phys resist; 3 MP for first strike and +10% dodge. Those would be more interesting glyphs, at least.

My thoughts as to WONAFYT are essentially the same as they were... wow, three months ago. It's occasionally useful for Tikki Tooki-worshiping Assassins, but still by far the worst glyph in the game.
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby Darvin on Wed Nov 09, 2011 2:38 am

I like the idea of combining GETINDARE and BYSSEPS. I don't think repeatability is the way to go (this is pretty niche as it is with ENDISWAL, and that has accumulating gains). Being able to beat enemy first strike would make GETINDARE too similar to the new WEYWUT, and in my opinion it's already too similar as it is.
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby The Avatar on Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:09 am

What about WONAFYT?

What can you combine it with?

make it slow them like WEYTWUT?
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby Darvin on Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:27 am

make it slow them like WEYTWUT?

Too similar to WEYTWUT. Slow is already a niche effect, we can't have multiple glyphs doing it.

Honestly, this glyph needs a fundamental change the same way WEYTWUT and PISORF were. There just isn't much use in teleporting a random monster of equal or lower level to your location. I generally avoid fighting such monsters to begin with, so "finding" more of them is utterly inconsequential. As well, this is a glyph that is entirely without use if you find it late in dungeon exploration, since you've already uncovered pretty much all the monsters anyways.
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby The Avatar on Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:08 pm

Perhaps it should check one level above, then 2, then 3, so on until you hit the boss.
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby Sidestepper on Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:13 pm

Darvin wrote:
make it slow them like WEYTWUT?

Too similar to WEYTWUT. Slow is already a niche effect, we can't have multiple glyphs doing it.

Honestly, this glyph needs a fundamental change the same way WEYTWUT and PISORF were. There just isn't much use in teleporting a random monster of equal or lower level to your location. I generally avoid fighting such monsters to begin with, so "finding" more of them is utterly inconsequential. As well, this is a glyph that is entirely without use if you find it late in dungeon exploration, since you've already uncovered pretty much all the monsters anyways.


What if it created a new monster? I would definitely want to use something like that, although it might be too good a deal.
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Re: Is there ever any reason to not immediately convert WONA

Postby The Avatar on Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:11 pm

That would way too be powerful at later levels when you have killed everything. (Levels 8 and 9)

Or as a an assassin about to lev up and fight the boss. You could spam it for assassin fodder.
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