One for the beginners

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Re: One for the beginners

Postby gjaustin on Sun May 06, 2012 4:42 pm

I take back what I said about Thief Silver being impossible. It's just kind of silly, but it's beatable as I did so this morning.

As for Thief Gold, there are way to many ways for it to generate an unbeatable level. I think that either the rounding needs to change so that you can one-hit the 7 health monsters, or they need to be dropped to 6 health.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby Blovski on Sun May 06, 2012 5:18 pm

Calmer thoughts on Thief Silver

I really like a lot of the things the level makes you do - forcing you to pick up powerups before confronting enemies, use some glyphs you might not normally, work out (or more accurately get used to) the +30% bonus and to take advantage of the potions.

HOWEVER

it is frequently impossible, invariably tricky and very tough to predict. I'd maybe make the level a little less mazy, place the level 2s and 3s closer to the player (maybe middle-distance, currently you basically have to find them and at least 2-3 powerups in your first exploring run or you'll face the rest of the level with basically no chance), weaken the enemies just a tiny bit in some way (so you're slightly less dependent on hitting powerups early/in the right order) or lower the boss's health a tad so you've got a little more lee-way with mistakes, and prevent those chests from blocking passageways.

Yeah, as I said, I really like the ideas of the level but as it is it tends to promote restarts rather than adaptive play.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby Blovski on Sun May 06, 2012 8:14 pm

And done the Thief Gold - much easier than the silver in my book, though still prone to generating really hopeless starts. Neat level though.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby The Avatar on Sun May 06, 2012 8:26 pm

I agree. The guard captain could use a serious nerf. If you gave him 300-500 hp he would be more in line with the wizard silver and fighter silver.

I just realized you do get gods on Sorc silver. I just hadn't unlocked any yet on my testing profile.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby Malow on Mon May 07, 2012 12:05 am

I saw in the earlier posts that someone mentionned that Patches was a good prep with the vampire. What are the actual positive effects that it gives? The only one I saw so far is 4% resist all, that happened once in 6 level up. Other than that, I think I also got some gold, but I didn't see the amount. What are the other positive effects?
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby The Avatar on Mon May 07, 2012 12:50 am

Extra hp, mp, and attack bonus.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby Joist on Mon May 07, 2012 12:51 am

+attack bonus, +max health and +max mana are the only others I know of.

Some people take the view that, with careful prep, Patches is great over the long term. I kind of hate him though, much rather go for some extra gold or dark tiles than risk being teleported across the map.

edit: damn Avatar ninja'd me.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby The Avatar on Mon May 07, 2012 12:54 am

The thing is that the Vampire ignores poison and mana burn, so Patches main to detrimental effects are nullified.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby Darvin on Mon May 07, 2012 12:55 am

Bonuses:
+attack bonus, +max health, +max mana, +gold, +physical/magic resist

Penalties:
Randomly reveals tiles, poison, mana burn, randomly teleports you

All of Patches' penalties are short-term, while all of his bonuses are long-term. He can be a pain at times, but he's really no more of a gamble (less these days) than worshipping JJ.

For the vampire, he not only ignores poison and mana burn, but really has less value from exploration than other classes so he loses less from that penalty as well.
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Re: One for the beginners

Postby Joist on Mon May 07, 2012 12:56 am

Many promising runs have been ended by Patches teleporting me somewhere. It might just be me (I reallly want to know what RNG this game uses) but I get a teleport every 5 level ups or so.

I *might* prep him if the level is fairly open but definitely not in places like Dragon Isles or VHoS.

edit: C'mon guys, stop ninja'ing me

edit2: And on the JJ note Darvin makes, I have never taken JJ since his piety nerf. I might take him under extreme conditions but those conditions haven't arisen yet.
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