Ok, so I've finally started the final throught sweep through the game in order to enjoy all the stuff that was brought in since last time. This will be the "rambling notes" thread where I write stuff down as it comes. I hope noone takes me opening a thread like this the wrong way and any comments are much appriciated. I will make notes which I think are important in red to let any dev's reading easily identify what I consider more than rambling (EDIT - turned out i listed complaints in red, and likes in green, oh well - a condense-them-up will be coming). As usual, I mean well, and if ignoring all this makes anyone's life easier by all means do so.
So first batch:1) The intro level
- I'm talking about the "cave" where you run a guard through. Was it ever discussed between the devs and the community? It has always struck me as a bit placeholdery, quite a bit "in medias res" and all that. I know sticking a tutorial in there might annoy old players who allready know stuff, but I'm sort of sure that another solution could be more beneficial. If it were a choice between "Hide in the cave" and "Skip it in manner X" where hiding in the cave would simply let you start with a bit more gold would be pretty nice. Just an idea, and that map could merit a discussion. Or nor. By this popint we've estableshed that the game is deep and unintuitive in quite few respects, thrusting players into a "wtf am I suppsed to do" situation might not be the best idea and it introduces the sensation stone among other things and probably leaves people thinking it WAS the tutorial so they skip the actual ones (there was a tendency). Anywho, sorry for long first note, been a while coming...Like
- the new graphics, the banners for toasts, the hands, the advisor and all that. Very nice and the text looks much easier to swallow down when we have a face to attach it to. Also, there might be one too many text box where you get congratulated. There's a lot of text in short sucession, and "there's one too many here" thought ran through my head. Doesn't have to mean anything. EDIT: this is when the advisor is first intorduced and you are conratualted for building the fighters guild)Adventuring permit tutorilal
- "Excellent non-decision!"
Ok, so it's a nice little interface intro. Doesn't let me powergame by choosing the dungeons but I guess that was never ment to be a feature. It used to be easier with the old map instead of the new graphical interface, bit it's an understandable tradeoff. (EDIT: noticed later that there are hints to dungeon contents in the sidebar itself)???
- There doesn't seem to be an indicator explaining the conversion mechanics in the first of the 3 intro dungeons I went into with the fighter. The only indicator so far was the sensation stone in the first cave TM, and, well, the fact that there are redundant glyphs but maybe some hand holding in this resepect might be ok? Just saying...Like
- The whole graphics/advisor/hands thing is doing a great job of guiding me to play the game and building up my confidence in whoever made it. This is probably the first time I'm not in the least bit inclined to try to think my way around just about anything on screen but am in fact pleased by letting the game take me along. Big thumbs up!Like
- The advizor's short summaries on classess when you are choosing the second guild to build are very nice.Related idea
- Maybe an advisor icon on the right side sidebar to see what he thinks about stuff to enable this?A make-it-tidy-idea
- I know there's a no-new-content policy and stuff, but there are 4 inital classes and the tutorial dungeons are sort of designed to fit the fighter-thef-wizard bias leaving the priest as the odd man out. And I know adding a 4th one would be trouble with the graphics in the kingdom. But maybe you could make the very first one a "chase them out of the settlement" fighter thing, and the 3 dungeons be a priest-wizard-thief thing and all that. Just a thought, might even be a good one.
Next 3 allready copied into the Codex thread but:!!!
- There is no indication in the game that there IS a codex. It took me a while to discover it on the new profile (I didn't play since it was added so I didn't know it was there!) It should probably be the first thing the advisor points out, that he's making notes of anythign you find!???
- Also, the entry for Wheytwut being a hacked wonnafy can be confusing because you can in fact unlock it before you unlock wonnafyt. Maybe a different flavour for the glyph?The inacessible codex entries
- are a bit unsatisfying since you know there are markers for them but no clue whatsoever what they are supposed to be there for. They're bossess and gods, but maybe they should be organized differently and only appear once you actually unlock any of them with the advisor telling you a new category has been unlocked?Lingering on something
- The sensation stone in the first cave TM creates a codex entry, and it's a relatively obscure item which a player isn't likely to find again any time soon. And the codex fills up with stuff you better get familliar with soonish. I understand there needed to be a way to point conversion as a mechanic out right away, but I really whish there was better way to do this for all the reasons I've listed in various entries...Appology
- Found the conversion tutorial signboard in the third dungeon I entered. Well, I supposed it'd be there somewhere, but well, at least I've documented an experience you can have. This is why I make a rambling thread like this first and concise-it-up in a later thread. Sorry about it all.Advisor thing
- There were 2 instances so far where Advisor was too pushy. Minor most likely, but still noticable. One was when I completed something and he railroaded me towards my next run which ment I had to go back to upgrade something, and the other was with the banker quest. He gave me no time to look at my kingdom and see what's in there (the whole banker quest set up a cascade of stuff which took a while, and if I wanted to say upgrade the blacksmith I had to go back or possibly just click through all that fast to do what I wanted to do). Anywho, the other thing is if you follow up on his instructions you lock yourself out of the "exploit Hobbler while it still gives rewards" perk. I don't know how you guys feel about it at all, and the pro thing is to actually avoid Hobbler like the plague until the PQI to get 500 gold out of evey possible badge and class in there, but there might be times when the advisor could simply be a corner of the screen popup that you click on for advice on what to do next.Like
The Wonnafyt codex entry.!!!
- a bunch of codex stuff I wrote in the codex thread.!!!
- I had NO CLUE you could left click on the monsters and I've been playing for an hour and did 4 dungeons (tutorial ones). This would've been huge if I were a new player!Like
- The dudebro dwarven emissary introduction was very nice. It's also a nice way to introduce them, much better than it used to be. Also for the Hippy elf girl Related small flavour nitpick
- The bankers move into the kingdom after you defeat two of their own! And the elves and dvarwes moved in after helping them. It makes sense, but is just begging for a joke along the lines of you creating work opportunities by efficently downsizing the company or something.Color coded toast banners
- I'm liking them a lot.Toast structural issue
- The "new quest unlocked" banners opening up on the adventurig map thing is a bit bad. Thing is that two runs in a row I've been left with nothing happening in the kingdom that would allow me to formulate a plan, but then when I clicked on the adventure button - BAM! New quest unlocked! I thouhgt about it and its like this - what the game wants you to do is hit the "adventure" button, but it tells you this in a majestic way AFTER you hit the adventure button. Just saying in case there's more of this stuff.Related idea
- Maybe have the "Beginner Brigade" be announced on the kingdom screen, possibly by the advisor, and then all the directional quests which unlock simmultaneously with it pop up on the adventuring map screen. If there's such a thing as an Exporation "guild adviser" with a portrait simmilar to the kingdom advisor and the taxidermist, he'd be a good guy to introduce the directions and all that. Just saying.Found the "right click on the monsters to find the info" hint...
- in the actual tutorial by actively looking for it explicitly
. Really, I knew it'd be somewhere, but the structure of the very beginning and the realtive obscurity of the actual tutorials has just caused me, a veteran out to explore all the new content and be strung along by the new advisor system to find this important bit of info rather late. This game needs a proper tutorial (a non obscure one), and the experience can seriously be hurt by misleading people with the whole current intro thing, but I'm sure you guys know that allready. It could've been said in less worda alltogather but still, there you have it, it's an actual issue Tutorial/Puzzle system
Otherwise it's good and I'm glad it's there and I'm especially liking the sidebar system that lets you select puzzles and all that. Having to die to the first goat might be a bit misleading, though, but that topic leads to unnecessary disscussions.In fact
- simply substitiuting the curent intro cave sequence for it in some way would probably work out really fine. Lampshade all the hints as written in an ancient runes or somesuch. It's easy to complete and actually introduces you to stuff in a meaningfull way. IDK. Your caravan got cornered and the only way out was into a Moria like Tut'Oriel dungeon and fighting your way through it led you to the spot where you can found your kingdom and all that...
Ok, enough for now, but I guess I wanted to give a bit of a detailed experience with the beginning and I'll surely condense it for the concise version. If anyone's reading, what would be the good point to stop and concise up the notes for the "very early game?" Anyone who'd like a clarification of what I ment by an obscure note? Any thoughts in general?