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Re: Did you guys know this?

PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:52 pm
by The Avatar
Yes. Hence the acid caster. Or was that not supposed to be a question. Well, EM wizards are very powerful and so are warlords. On the other hand, I don't use her that much outside of those two classes. What about you guys?

Re: Did you guys know this?

PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:15 pm
by Dreamdancer
Think only difference between IAMWALing monsters and plants is that the later do not give gold.

Re: Did you guys know this?

PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:51 pm
by Lujo
The Avatar wrote:Yes. Hence the acid caster. Or was that not supposed to be a question. Well, EM wizards are very powerful and so are warlords. On the other hand, I don't use her that much outside of those two classes. What about you guys?


Yeah, was playful irony.

I seem to have some vague recollections about thinking that Imawal for xp and vine form for B2P and clearance for extra burst is actualy good with Bloodmage (you might thing either plantation or sanguine will suffer but it's not necessarily so). Not the best in the world but it's actually fine.

Priests and Monks with avatars codex are pretty much god tier.

Fighters obviously love their XP gain, nothing compares to TT with them, but... dat IMAWAL. In general EM can always be played to have no effective downside apart from opportunity costs. Technicaly, the 4 non-commital deities for me are Mystera (don't prep when I want any semblance of challenge or in CO), GG (strictly a piety farm, so don't prep if I actually want to use the deity I prep), Binlor (don't prep if I don't want to have to work for destroying any semblance of challenge) and EM. EM guarantees IMAWAL, and at least a few clearances and Entaglement and doesn't necessarily win on her own or take much effort to use so I go with her most of the time.

I've used her sucessfuly in vicious dungeons with just about anyone. She's also really, really good in Cursed Oasis (like, really good)

Re: Did you guys know this?

PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 12:48 am
by The Avatar
Very good points. To clarify, I was excluding the codex because it makes her good with every class. Funny, I never seem to use EM fighters. The TT ones are just too fun.

Re: Did you guys know this?

PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 1:29 am
by Incompetent
The Avatar wrote:Yes. Hence the acid caster. Or was that not supposed to be a question. Well, EM wizards are very powerful and so are warlords. On the other hand, I don't use her that much outside of those two classes. What about you guys?


She seems pretty versatile to me.

Entanglement and the free IMAWAL (+plenty of plants to petrify) are good for pretty much everyone for the extra XP, and Entanglement can also be used as a WEYTWUT/GETINDARE substitute against difficult enemies. Most characters can get good mileage out of Clearance. Greenblood and Vine Form are a bit more specialised, but brawlers can do well with them early on and everyone will run into situations where Vine Form lets them take one more hit. The inidividual boons might not be the most powerful out there, but everyone can get a ton of them and/or a strong pact because Plantation gives so much, the boons are so cheap and there are so few penalised actions. Finally, you can convert out and immediately desecrate for a negligible penalty in the late game. As long as the dungeon isn't desperately cramped and I'm not playing a Bloodmage or something, I'm always happy to see an Earthmother altar.

Re: Did you guys know this?

PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 1:42 am
by Lujo
You might reconsider on the bloodmage thing, too - Bloodmages love their HP boosts, and Vine Form is dirt cheap. A few early hits means more B2P.

And the free desecration! Wow! I totaly forgot about that - that was in fact so good that prepping a burn salve just in case was the default for me back when there were 5 potion prep slots and not 4. Any way it was so good that I always desecrated her on sight by default and didn't even try her so it actually took me a while to realize just how awesome she is (apart from Warlord interactions, those are obvious a mile off).

And, err, Vineform IS niche (and bloodmage falls within that niche, as well as the clearance 10 mana niche - he only has 10 mana by default even though he's generally better off with Mystera specificaly). Greenblood isn't so niche since it stacks with both Burndayraz and Pissorff (and Entanglement, IMAWAL and Clearance are fine on anyone) that you could probably go nuts with it on anyone.

Also, a few dungeons that are in fact challenging and fun are totaly destroyed by EM. Those are Cursed Oasis and Hex Ruins.