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Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2016 5:05 pm
by choongmyoung
So it was a small glitch... huh.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:30 pm
by zayyeh
choongmyoung wrote:The Avatar boss in the Demonic Library seems to spawn ???s when the burning stack pops.
Does anyone know whether he spawns them when you are outside of the arena, attacking other monster to pop the burning stack?
And if he spawns them, can you get into the arena when he spawns a ??? on the dungeon stair? (Too lazy to experiment myself)


Enemies can't be spawned on occupied tiles like dungeon stairs. That means, that if there would be only 4 unoccupied tiles left + dungeon stair, The Avatar would spawn only 4 mimics.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 2:28 pm
by choongmyoung
I'm editing the wiki nowadays, and doing some experiments when needed.

First, I found out that some dungeon difficulties or monster stats% are not correct.
* SMM's attack is around 64.2% versus normal, not 64% nor 65% (48 in normal dungeons and 77 with VT, try to calculate yourself)
* Cursed Oasis' difficulty is around 114.5%, not 114% nor 115%. (Cursed Dragon has 546 health without VT and 954 with VT) And even more, it's 114.7% based on his attack. (86, 120)
* The Labyrinth's difficulty is calculated to be 125% based on Rex's attack (82 without VT, 105 with VT) but 130% based on Rex's health (412 without VT, 636 with VT). It's even more complicated because based on what you use, you get 129.2% to 129.9% and not 130%, but there's contradiction that no difficulty modifier can explain all of the stats.
* The first two forms of Namtar have 476 health. They have 636 health on VT so it's certain that they have 100% health stat, but If the difficulty is set to 150% they should have 477 health not 476. Is the difficulty 149.9% or something?
* and many more...
What's wrong with this? Maybe VT does not set 160% attack and 200% health? Is rounding on and off messing around? (My calculation is based on rounding off once after all the calculations, I didn't experimented about berserk mechanism) It's quite certain that Rex's attack (82) is weirdly low, it should be around 84 to 85. I'm confused.

Second, JJ's first worship random piety bonus seems like it's based on your current level. It seems like the maximum piety you can get is ((your level)^2 - 1). Is there anyone who knows the minimum piety? Anyone knows exact mechanism?
Based on my experiments, you get 0 piety at lv1, 2-3 piety at lv2, 6-8 piety at lv3, 11-15 piety at lv4, 18-24 piety at lv5, .... It may look like 75% of the max is the minimum piety you'll get, but I was once given 35 piety at lv7.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:19 pm
by zayyeh
Let me asnwer on Jehora question for now:

You get level^2 x random(0.7,1), where random(0.7,1) is a random value between 0.7 and 1. The value gets rounded down after all the calculations.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:30 pm
by The Avatar
I'm almost certain that it truncates instead of rounding. Furthermore, although I forget if this is the case (did all this math awhile ago), it may truncate twice since it does the modifier math separately for monsters and difficulties.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:31 pm
by choongmyoung
zayyeh wrote:You get level^2 x random(0.7,1), where random(0.7,1) is a random value between 0.7 and 1.

Ah, oh, yes, it makes sense. Does it returns 0.7 or 1 at extreme cases? It seems it never returns 1 but it might be the case where returning exact 1.0000 is almost impossible.

The Avatar wrote:I'm almost certain that it truncates instead of rounding. Furthermore, although I forget if this is the case (did all this math awhile ago), it may truncate twice since it does the modifier math separately for monsters and difficulties.


Oh, mistake on my language- I was talking a truncating. My original guess [(base stat) × (monster-specific stat%) × (difficulty modifier%) → truncate] was wrong. Okay, thiking about it-

Guess: (base stat) × (monster-specific stat%) → truncate → (difficulty modifier%) → truncate?
SMM(VT): 75×65% → 48 → 48×160% → 76 nope
Rex(VT): 75×87.5% → 65 → 65×160% → 104 nope
Rex(normal): 75×87.5% → 65 → 65×130% → 84 nope

Guess: (base stat) × (difficulty modifier%) → truncate → (monster-specific stat%) → truncate?
SMM(VT): 75×160% → 120 → 120×65% → 78 nope
Rex(VT): 75×160% → 120 → 120×87.5% → 105 okay (87.5% attack is calculated based on this actually)
Rex(normal): 75×130% → 97 → 97×87.5% → 84 nope

Not only the Rex's attack, but truncating is not even able to explain Namtar's first two forms, which have 476 health. 315 multiplied by 150% is exactly 477. And SMM's attack% is surely not 65% nor 64% but in between. I'm still confused.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:37 pm
by zayyeh
What is the difference between rounding down and truncating assuming we talk about positive numbers?

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:22 pm
by SparklingFire
It's the same thing. I guess he didn't notice the word down after rounding in your sentence.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:29 pm
by zayyeh
choongmyoung wrote:
zayyeh wrote:You get level^2 x random(0.7,1), where random(0.7,1) is a random value between 0.7 and 1.

Ah, oh, yes, it makes sense. Does it returns 0.7 or 1 at extreme cases? It seems it never returns 1 but it might be the case where returning exact 1.0000 is almost impossible.

Yes, it does.

Re: Miscellaneous Questions Topic

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:14 am
by Unidentified Tower
When an item in my inventory has a green name, does that mean "This is taken from a locker, you won't get gold for selling it at the end of the dungeon and you'd better bring it back unless you want to pay to replace it"?