Disappointed..

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Disappointed..

Postby xspeedballx on Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:50 pm

So.. and I am really not trying to stir anything up here.. but I wanted to say it. I have vanished from these forums intentionally a few months ago because I found the environment growing caustic, non-productive, and honestly a waste of time. I have kept note of all of the new improvements to UI and poked and played with them as I have had time lately(less than I would like, work + kids make it hard). I came back into the forums today hoping to see active discussion about improvements to the UI, what is working, what people are thinking to better add polish and such. Something I can latch on and really help bring the game forward.

What I find? The same topics from months ago, the same old arguments, the same hot emotions, and the same irritation that the community that seemingly has the easiest time to talk to the devs, spending so much energy seemingly not helping.

Why am I typing this? Because I am disappointed. I liked this community. I love this game, and I love seeing it growing as mature as it is with all of the polish. The community is now frustrating, and boring. It is likely just an isolated group but it is reverberating through this forum. I am a nobody, and I am from nowhere. But I wanted to let you all know this because I have never previously been short on sharing my opinions here so I want to share this(hopefully not last but maybe) one.
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby Lujo on Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:48 pm

So what's to say? Whole lot of this stuff was a long time coming, the new control schemes need a bit of time and bugs ironed out before people can realy give feedback, the new icons are mostly nice. I guess everyone's happy that they're finally there and noone really wants to complain about particular pictures - who'd want to suggest putting artists through more work?

The codex, the statistics and a whole bunch of other stuff is still on it's way and they'll get lots of feedback probably, but as far as contributing past a few bugs - not much to do. Balancing the game is over - and most people here are players, as far as I'm aware. Dev's implemented a lot of stuff - missclick protection and all that - hurrah, but quite a few of those things where discussed to death already and were not here earlier because of the scope of the work.

What IS there to latch on to? Besides the things we can't comment yet, the god forsaken locker slot mess is the only unresolved thing around. Past complementing the devs and artists on a good job for every new batch of things that shows up, is there anything left to do? We could fill the wiki up, I guess...
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby Bloggorus on Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:13 am

Lujo wrote:What IS there to latch on to? Besides the things we can't comment yet, the god forsaken locker slot mess is the only unresolved thing around. Past complementing the devs and artists on a good job for every new batch of things that shows up, is there anything left to do? We could fill the wiki up, I guess...


Hate to say I agree with Lujo on this one. Without weekly injections of new game-breaking bugs, items, dungeons, challenges and content there's not much to do on these forums but navel-gaze.

There's been a new crop of players injecting interesting asides but the sheer volume of information in this forum means most conversations are already covered exhaustively and are easily searchable.
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby dislekcia on Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:54 am

Lujo wrote:We could fill the wiki up, I guess...


That would be a lot better than trying to resurrect tired "arguments" over features that simply won't be in the game.

Honestly, I understand the desire for an editor much better and yet people seem fine with accepting that it's not a priority right now - getting the game done is. For some reason Avatar isn't trying to turn every thread into a discussion of how cool an editor would be. And I'm grateful for that.
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby The Avatar on Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:22 am

Lol. You're welcome. The thing is that there's nothing new to comment on, and the only reason you are seeing (or will ever see) bad attitudes here are because the locker thing has been brought up recently (I tried to stop it, I promise). The only new thing is my commentary on Jay's videos and more sporadic and random strategy discussions. The problem with the wiki is that new art will keep coming out. The devs explicitly said that there will be practically no more balance changes, so what should we do?

Actually, I'm curious, beyond the locker discussions, where do you see bad attitudes?
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby Bloggorus on Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:44 am

I thought attitudes were up. Jay's videos have had everyone watching instead of talking. Heaps of praise for devs and newbs giving much needed feedback.

Even the discussion of the lockers was more of a summary recap of the devs (justified) reasons for not changing it. Lujo is only only one still beating that horse with textwalls.

Until he came along, the conversation was more about the merits of hacking a game open weighed against ruining the challenge for yourself.

You'd think he'd have learned his lesson by now. Can we put a word limit or something on him? ;)
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby The Avatar on Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:59 am

I thought attitudes were up. Jay's videos have had everyone watching instead of talking. Heaps of praise and news giving much needed feedback.


Everyone not talking but me. I might never stop talking. My bad ;) Agreed though. Things have been good recently.
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby Lujo on Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:24 am

Bloggorus wrote:Even the discussion of the lockers was more of a summary recap of the devs (justified) reasons for not changing it. Lujo is only only one still beating that horse with textwalls.


The problem is I gave up trying to achieve anything back before the first discussion and was trying to tell everyone they'd get nowhere with it even back then. "If anything ever happens, we'll read it off a changelog" - my exact words. There's still a section of the audience being told "We don't want your kind here" by the game itself, for no good reason. Heck, the whole speech with the comic when I got banned this time around missed the point entirely.

Anywho, there's still art to come for the wiki, and I'm sure there will be people to fill it up nicely and concisely when the codex comes and art for items becomes more available. If someone want's to fish for everything now, be my guest. I won't textwall on lockers, but I won't textwall on the wiki either. After all, I'm totaly not a target audience for the game, what could I possibly teach newbies about strategy? And with the low locker churn, and playing the game wrong all this time, I probably cant tell my elbow from my arse...
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby Bloggorus on Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:30 am

Lujo wrote:
Bloggorus wrote:Even the discussion of the lockers was more of a summary recap of the devs (justified) reasons for not changing it. Lujo is only only one still beating that horse with textwalls.


The problem is I gave up trying to achieve anything back before the first discussion and was trying to tell everyone they'd get nowhere with it even back then. "If anything ever happens, we'll read it off a changelog" - my exact words. There's still a section of the audience being told "We don't want your kind here" by the game itself, for no good reason. Heck, the whole speech with the comic when I got banned this time around missed the point entirely.

Anywho, there's still art to come for the wiki, and I'm sure there will be people to fill it up nicely and concisely when the codex comes and art for items becomes more available. If someone want's to fish for everything now, be my guest. I won't textwall on lockers, but I won't textwall on the wiki either. After all, I'm totaly not a target audience for the game, what could I possibly teach newbies about strategy... And with the low locker churn, and playing the game wrong all this time, I probably cant tell my elbow from my arse...


Am i supposed to feel sorry for you? Seriously, this passive aggressive language is getting very tiresome. Letting us know you are aware of your failings is not justification for repeating them.
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Re: Disappointed..

Postby Lujo on Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:47 am

Bloggorus wrote:Am i supposed to feel sorry for you? Seriously, this passive aggressive language is getting very tiresome. Letting us know you are aware of your failings is not justification for repeating them.


My failings? My only failing is that I'm boring you. That's not much of a failing in the grander scheme of things.

Can I feel legit resentment? Really, with everything I've been called you'd think I have no clue about DD. Noone's supposed to feel sorry, but someone calling for extra activity, switching subjects and everything else has to take that sort of thing into account. "We don't like this feedback, bring us some other feedback." Immagine the devs running a nuclear reactor, and it starts leaking, but they tell the guys who are reporting it that they aren't interested in such feedback, that they want positive minded one? (tone the facility down to be less bombastic, if too large a metaphor).

If I'm being snide while I suggest I'd rather give no feedback at all - it's still a good thing. It means I stop boring you. Problem solved.
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