Difference between revisions of "Brainstorming"

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dislekcia: Can we put in a picture of the game and a link to the latest version in the "Welcome" area? I can't see how to edit that...
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{{ArchiveBox|[[Brainstorming/Archive1|Archive 1]]||}}
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:Well, I've added the front-page link, but you're going to have to either upload the image or enable external image linking ($wgAllowExternalImages) for me to do the screenshot. - [[User:Chippit|Chippit]] 09:46, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
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Would it be possible to include a number amount for the damage increase in the tooltip of Bysepps (and in other similar situations)?
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== Suggestions about this wiki ==
  
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Almost: Some indication or acknowledgement of the thief's first attack bonus or the berserker's bonus damage when attacking higher level monsters when hovering the mouse over them would be nice.
 
  
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* Also, account for damage reduction when showing how much damage enemies do.
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== Suggestions for the game interface ==
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* Make a tile selection overlay, so we can avoid misclicking a tile.
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* Remove the "death/safe/victory" system. It gets too easy when you can just rely on that.(Disagree) [Maybe as an option, but not generally.]
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* Add a way of turning off the custom cursor, which causes lag on some slower computers.(Seconded)
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** When the game window loses focus, the mouse cursor does not get shown when you move it inside the game window again. This might be fixed by the above suggestion.
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* As mentioned before, add diagonal movement for arrow keys. Right now it is possible, but not optimal to use the keys because you have to use the mouse to access certain places.
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* Hotkeys: P for Pray/Pick Up/Purchase, numbers to choose between worship options, Space exits the Game Over screen.
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* Delayed keypress to allow for diagonal movement without numerical keyboard.(Yes,yes,yes!)
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* Please, please, PLEASE include WASD functionality. Arrow keys/mouse or just clicking around both feel awkward.
  
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salejemaster: I'm not sure how to do this but we should somehow change the screenshots that are posted here in the tigdb http://db.tigsource.com/games/desktop-dungeon to screenshots from .5 because the new tile set is much better then the old one, and you know how graphics matter to people, if anyone has any info on how to do this please post :)
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== Suggestions for the Gods system ==
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* Taurog followers get 50% HP restoration from any potion and no mana restoration.
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* New boon for Glowing Guardian: +25% damage to undead.
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* Increase initial piety when joining Mystera Annur.
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* New boon for Earthmother: double HP regeneration.
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* Give -5 max HP for joining to Dracul, but don’t increase hero level.
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** I would prefer -5 max HP OR -15% to -20% max HP, whichever bigger. That way, it encourages joining early on, making for risky gameplay. In fact, all of Dracul's boon should work like that. Currently, the costs for boons are rather weak.
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* Reduce piety gain for teleporting glyph when worshipping Tikki Tooki.
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* a stupid one, but maybe host a contest and the winner is made a god in DD, with stats s/he decides.
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* [[Taurog]] should not ban the usage of [[WONAFYT]]. (Seconded)
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* Converting should be consolidated to a single slot. Having to take up a slot for each god is redundant. It should also be less expensive to convert in the first place.
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* [[Binlor Ironshield]] should only grant 1.6 piety gain for wall destroying with ENDISWAL. This can be accomplished easily by giving out 8 piety gain for every 5 walls destroyed.
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* [[Jehora Jeheyu]] should give better piety gain outside of [[WEYTWUT]]
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* [[Tikki Tooki|Tikki Tooki's]] First Strike boon needs it's cost reduced significantly. It's nowhere near as good as the Poison Strike boon. And forget about converting from Pactmaker. I'd rather have another boon.
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* Each god should have their own unique altar sprite, especially since the new build is trying to be more visually informative. It would also be awesome if some character art of the god was pictured next to their list of boons.
  
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== Suggestions for the Scoring system ==
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* Make score not dependent on time.
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* For ranked matches, have it throw out any run over 15 minutes. These runs will never score high up anyway, and it makes fixing the current scoring measure unneccessary.
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* Unstoppable is grossly overrated at 2000 points. You're already getting a lot of score for having killed the monsters, and this amounts to double-dipping the same activity. It's not even that hard to do; unless you're down to the wire and have no resources left, you're essentially over the hump and it's all downhill after killing the boss. Other achievements such as "Cocky, aren't you?" are significantly more difficult to pull off.
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* Give us a bonus for never worshipping gods or buying items. A bad set of shops/alters can be a big handicap, and being able to abstain altogether for a score boost would be a nice equilizer.
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* "Tooth and Fricken Nail" should not be earned when using death protection. This method is just too easy to perform.
  
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== Suggestions for the glyph system ==
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* Reduce ENDISWAL mana cost by 1-4 points.
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* Reduce CYDSTEPP mana cost by 1-2 points.
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** CYDSTEPP is horribly overpowered; if anything it needs a cost increase of 1 to 2 points (let the Warlord use it for 10; everyone else should need a mana powerup to use this glyph)
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* Reduce PISORF mana cost by 2-5 points.
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* Reduce BURNDAYRAZ mana cost by 1 point.
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* Make IMAWAL spawn only if there's a Earthmother altar around.
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** Just grant IMAWAL upon worshipping the Earthmother, and never make it spawn in. Really it needs a secondary benefit; otherwise its only use is appeasing the Earthmother.
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* Add a glyph that allows you to Scry a part of the dungeon without actually exploring it. You could make it random, but instead of random spots, it reveals a 3x3 or 4x4 somewhere around the map each use.
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* An "undo" spell. You could call it "UPZIDAYZI" or something. I can't count the number of times I've made a game losing mistake just because I've misclicked. You could keep undoing until you ran out of mana, but would not be able to extend this with mana potions since you would just "undo" their usage, and obviously wouldn't be able to undo death.
  
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Perhaps the Bloodmage and Vampire should have the ''option'' to pick up blood patches.
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== General suggestions ==
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Perhaps it could be done via the glyph interface.
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* Remove the gold keep between levels. As it is pointless since one can farm gold with some good characters. (seconded; looking at you goblin + any T3 class)
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Of course, if a summoned monster dies on a glyph, then I suppose that could lead to trouble.
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** This would also allow us to "score" based on accumulated gold.
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* Starting gold could be set to 50 Gold, and gold piles could give more gold (5 + lvl/2).
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* Online play would be neato. Maybe Co-Op and Versus. (Disagree, I don't think that would work to well for a game like this, especially one that's meant as a coffee-break/on your Iphone, sort of thing. Perhaps what your looking for instead, is some sort of party gameplay where you get to use multiple characters. Maybe 3?)
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* Settings or configuration of some sort, perhaps with options similar to other roguelikes, would be a good idea.
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* Once again, carry-over gold is a pretty ineffective part of the game right now. I would suggest removing it, increase the amount of gold per pickup during dungeons, and add a carry-over stat for minimum gold and have it increase via special dungeon wins the same way maximum gold does now. Right now, gold pick ups don't matter much mid-dungeon, even if you waste quite a few, but you still want the maximum gold value to matter.
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* Add "traps". Invisible to player they do damage when stepped on, if player lives & tiles have been revealed health & mana is added as normal. Trap is now visible but will still do damage each crossing. 3 types for increasing difficulty; pit,spiked pit,poisoned spiked pit. IMAWAL fills in pits removing trap. Some characters have 'detect trap' trait allowing them to see traps before stepping on them. 'detect trap' boon for earthmother. earthmother gives piety for traps removed with IMAWAL as her goats are now safe :) (this also makes imawal & earthmother more attractive)(If they considered using traps, they could also add trapdoors that forced a player into one of the new minidungeons)
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** Walking over an invisible trap with a low HP character right after a tough battle and dying right then and there would be ''really'' annoying. Definitely make traps visible all the time. These would also make playing a 1st level vampire an exercise in frustration, but if visible they could act as a much-needed vampire nerf.
  
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== Suggestions for Objects / Shops ==
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* Make health potions and vampiric items cheaper in shops.
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** How much cheaper can health potions go!? They cost 12 gold.
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* Add the number of health/mana restored by the potion to it's tooltip. (SECONDED) [THIRDED]
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* Give Troll Heart some more benefit. The benefits it grants trickle in too slowly and are rarely meaningful even for a rogue.
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* Lower the cost of Bonebreaker. 29 gold for the effect of a 2 mana glyph is a joke, especially with Band of Courage offering a the effect of a 10 mana glyph for only 20 gold.
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* Give some sort of penalty to buying zombie dog. 1 GP for death protection is a ridiculously good deal.
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* Remove the option for shops to sell WEYTWUT; most players would prefer to restart if they're penned in then blow 50 gold and gamble they end up somewhere useful. Sell a more interesting glyph in its place, like LEMMISI, APHEELSIK or CYDSTEPP.
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* Wicked Guitar's downside is so steep it's almost never beneficial, especially at that high price point.
  
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== Suggestions for the Classes/Races ==
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* Add a class (such as "Explorer" or "Spelunker") that semi-reveals tiles 2 spaces away from the character, showing the player what is on the tile without uncovering it.
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* Number of gold gained by Tinker for killing monsters depends on monster’s level (divided by 2, rounded up).( If this was incorporated, it would probably round down instead)
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* Halfling and gnome have not bonus in potion count, but bonus in potions effectiveness.(about 60% instead of 40%)
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* Mana potions restore some (20-30%) health for berserkers.
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* Add a race that converts glyphs to piety. (Seconded)
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** Such a race really screams "restart until I get the alter I want".
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** And Golbin doesn't already scream " Restart until I get the shops I want?". Honestly, when you make a characters, as long as it isn't to easy to use, the amount of restarting the player would WANT to do (not need to do) shouldn't be taken into account as long as the class is still fun.
  
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DGM: For the wiki itself, a section for the spells should be added. Also, Glitterfingers is missing from the gods section. For the game, here are some ideas for the deity system:
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* Increase goblin gold when converting glyphs to something like 4+level.
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** So long as we can enter the dungeon with a whopping 160 gold, the goblin will never be anything more than a method to cheese gold farming.
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* Do not consume blood when a blood mage with full health steps on it.(Seconded) [THIRDED]
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* Add something akin to an amazon race, so that some female characters get thrown into the mix before someone inevitably asks for a female portrait of every character in the game come retail launch.
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* Priest starts with either all altars on map, or choice of god from the get-go.
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* Make a class that can only live for so many actions before dying
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* [[Fighter|Fighter's]] Pit Dog should be changed so that you have either kill 10 enemies or kill an enemy above your level to gain death protection. (Seconded)
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* [[Thief]] should lose Survivor and gain the ability to steal from stores. It should be an option under buy and it works 50% of the time. Currently Stabber and Survivor make it way too easy to conserve potions, making any dungeon a breeze. Plus Survivor, it's rather unrougelike ability.(Voted down, the amount of randomness in the game should be decreased, plus, the concequence for this type of choice could make or break a game consistantly)(it would make or break the game as much as Dodge would)(An average of a handful of free hits a game vs half the items on your map potentially free are two completely different bags of candy, my friend.)
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* Speaking of Survivor, Health Potions should not cure Mana Burn and Mana Potions should not cure Poison. Also cut the amount of mana Health Potions heal and vice versa.
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* Survivor and Hoarder should become it's own class, the Treasure Hunter. Add the ability to see items on the map an it's a solid class
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** The Thief kind of is the treasure hunter you're describing. It's just poorly named.
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* [[Crusader|Martyr]] should have first strike properties. Otherwise it's a joke. ( It's definitely not a joke with death protection, my friend.)(Except that it doesn't work with Death Protection either.)(My bad, you are correct, but at the same time, Martyr, as the name implies, is only useful once in a game, but when it is useful ITS REALLY USEFUL, when you are facing down a boss, it essentially does have first strike, you die, but you get credit for the kill)
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* Fearless is bad on Crusaders and needs to be replaced with something better. I would suggest something similar to [[Berserker|Berserker's]] Bloodlust or the ability to spawn more [[Boosters|Attack Boosters.]]
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* I don't remember if this was already suggested, but BURNDAYRAZ should not break Momentum
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** This would make it too easy to keep momentum. It's a liability, but a fitting liability.
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** Maybe casting fireball halves your current momentum? Replace the half with anything, but fireball should not be completely oppossed to the crusader's playing style(different user, btw).
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* [[Bloodmage]] with Power Hungry and [[BLUDTUPOWA]] currently do not jive very well. I propose that they lose Power Hungry and gain the ability to ignore magic resistance.
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* Meanwhile, Power Hungry along with the extra damaging [[BURNDAYRAZ]] ability and automatically summons BURNDARYAZ to your feet should be made into it's own class
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** Automatically summoning fireball is what the wizard will essentially be in the next version, the wiz will spawn two on the map and have a weighted chance of finding one early. Remember, the wiz can kill lvl 1's without magic, so he doesn't need it immediatly, no one really does.
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* [[Transmuter]] is cheap. I suggest that you only get HP when you destroy 5 walls as opposed to getting HP every time you destroy one wall.
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** Just raise the cost of ENDISWALL for him. If he runs out of mana, he has to explore to keep healing. Right now, if he has sufficient mana he can almost invariably finish his target before he runs out.
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* [[Vampire(race)|Vampires]] should have a higher costing BURNDARYAZ spell. Like 8 HP.
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** The spell cost is about right at the 1st level, but doesn't increase fast enough towerds the higher levels.
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* Maybe add a Ranger class? Comes with a glyph that deals physical damage without retaliation, but costs 8 gold instead of mana per cast. Then make it so that he deals less damage with BURNDAYRAZ?
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* Building off of the above idea, perhaps there could be a class that uses gold to cast glyphs, "Mercenary" or something, but has low health and attack?
  
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1) Dracul rejects Priests. Should the Glowing Guardian accept Assassin followers? It seems out of character, and it's a cheap way to steamroll the Assassin/Crypt challenge.
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== Still uncategorized ==
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:Seems TGG is pretty forgiving to me (more generous than the god they're copied from anyway!) - if you are an Assassin that isn't using poison, they're fine with it I think.  On the same topic, though, I think TGG altars shouldn't even spawn in the Crypt, because it basically makes it an auto-win for any class. --[[User:Twinge|Twinge]]
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* Make a mode with several dungeon levels (except campaign) like in classic roguelike games.
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* Give some gold for boss slaying.
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2) Binlor Ironshield gives the wall-buster spell when you convert to him. This should be used for other gods: Mystera Annur should give Fireball since her worshipers are helpless without it, and the Earthmother should give the stoning spell.
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* Make monster stats specific; a bit various for every monster. For example, a monster of type x of level y can have random HP value from 50 to 65 and random attack from 20 to 25. It will make game a bit more unpredictable and interesting.
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* Linux support. (Seconded, though I guess that this is up to the guys behind Unity. Also it works decently in Wine.)
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:Earthmother *does* give IMAWAL... providing it doesn't already exist.  Binlor is the same way with the ENDISWAL Glyph: if it already exists, he won't create it.  And that leads nicely to Mystera: BURNDAYRAZ is guaranteed to appear on every map anyways. All this said, it wouldn't be a bad idea to move the Glyphs to the player's feet when they convert to these gods --[[Special:Contributions/94.7.130.253|94.7.130.253]] 15:14, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
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* Special Dungeon: Colliseum. This special dungeon has no reward for completion and is unlocked after winning (AND SUBMITTING) a ranked game. This dungeon allows you to create your own dungeons and put them up for download for other players, the same way you can with tilesets currently. The control you have over the dungeon is over the types and amounts of monsters appearing( by lvl, so if I want all the lvl 1's in the dungeon to be goblins, I can), but not over the labrynth layout and the unlocks the player can bring in. You can also design your own boss ( or two bosses, I suppose) based on the normal bosses, but with variable special qualities, similar to the campaign bosses. Participating in this process might unlock a new class or some other bonus. This would help introduce new players to the DD community and can prove to be an even greater challenge on top of the campaign.
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* Save and view replays. The game would automatically record the player's actions and give the option to save or view it upon death or retirement. When viewing a replay, the player would only be allowed to move forward or back one action at a time and to mouse over objects for information.
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3) Speaking of the Earthmother and the stoning spell, she's lame mostly because the spell is lame. It denies you experience and doesn't clear obstacles out of the way; it has no use except to make her happy and her reward isn't good enough. I suggest having the spell only work on monsters below your level, but count as a regular kill (giving experience, triggering rewards/punishments from the gods, etc.). This would make it useful in its own right and make the Earthmother less painful to follow.
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* A new monster, possibly for a special dungeon, that can reflect BURNDAYRAZ damage back to the player. ( Unless it still took damage from the spell, burn would essentially be completely useless, so why not make it just plain immune to the spell? )
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:Rather than change the mechanic of the god and render the special Gorgon class somewhat irrelevant, why not just change the reward? +1HP per level per enemy petrified, perhaps. Or +1HP per monster level. -ChaoSpectre
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::The Earthmother giving regular XP for stone kills seems quite fair, as it balances with you not being able to take those stones out of the way.
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4) Glitterfingers just helps you get money, right? You can stockpile money easily enough anyway. How about having him spawn some potion shops to spend it on?
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:How about if Glitterfingers removed the cap on gold for that run only? If you had more than the max at the end of your run, then it would be reduced to the max. [[Special:Contributions/68.159.130.228|68.159.130.228]] 16:21, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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:He could certainly use something - right now he's vaguely useful to grind up some gold slightly faster between real games, and even then mostly only if you don't have Goblin unlocked.  Giving 2 gold per kill instead of 1 - and maybe also removing the cap as mentioned above - probably still doesn't actually make him useful, but would be a start I guess.  Glittergfingers should probably be revamped completely, but that can wait until the whole gold system is revamped.
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5) Right now there's not much reason to renounce a god except to see what happens. I'd like the option pick a god from the start (like race and class) instead of spawning random alters, so why not use the god's curses as part of another unlock system? If you level up at least, say, 5 times AFTER earning a god's disfavor and still win the game, you get the option to start with him as your deity. As an adjunct to this, let the player brick an alter with the stone spell or shatter it with the wall-buster spell as a way of angering the deity.
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rickgriffin: Thoughts about the high score board:
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1) Include which boss was defeated on the run.
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: Agreed. Also what god they were worshiping, if any. --[[User:Twinge|Twinge]]
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2) Besides the top score board, also have separate boards for each class, so people have a reason to have high score runs without just selecting the 'best' class/race.
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:Ideally there wouldn't be any clear best combos, and I think that is the goal down the road; there may be some combos that suck, but there shouldn't be any that dominate ranked games (I'm looking at you, Vampire & Human Rouge/Monk!)  Not that having separate charts for each class would be a bad thing, I'm just saying the bigger issue is one of overall balance =) --[[User:Twinge|Twinge]]
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* What about also having top score boards for each of the challenge dungeons, as well? [[User:Neongrey|Neongrey]] 21:04, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
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* Now that I think about it, having a score breakdown would be a neat thing too, so you could see what all contributed to a high score. [[Special:Contributions/68.159.130.228|68.159.130.228]] 13:28, 21 March 2010 (UTC) (rickgriffin)
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DGM: Suggestions for the glyph system:
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1) Certain glyphs - mainly the three teleportation spells - are vastly inferior to most other glyphs.  Rather than try to make all spells equally useful, though, I suggest dividing glyphs into two categories: Master glyphs and Apprentice glyphs.  Master glyphs would work as glyphs do now.  Apprentice glyphs would be weaker and/or more costly and would give no bonus on conversion, but each game some of them would spawn next to the player's starting position.  This would balance the glyphs and help eliminate hopeless starts.
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2) To go with the above idea, here's a suggested new spell: DUNBEESHOKD (Lightning Bolt) - 4 Mana.  Deals 2 damage per player level to a monster. This would be an apprentice version of Fireball, suitable for giving to the player from the start in case they want to go the pure magic route.
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3) Suggestions for specific spells:
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....BLUDTUPOWA needs work.  How about letting it turn a health potion into a mana potion instead?  That would make it more generally useful while keeping with the Blood Mage's health-for-power theme.
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....WEYTWUT teleports you somewhere useless or dangerous too often.  How about having it only take you to shops, glyphs and alters?  Or at least making it send you somewhere you haven't already explored?
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....I already discussed fixing IMAWAL when I talked about the Earthmother earlier, but I'll repeat it here for completeness: restrict it to enemies below the player's level, but let it count as a normal kill for reward/penalty purposes.
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Almost: If it's possible, generate dungeons from a seed number, and allow the player to replay maps by giving it the seed again or challenge a friend to do better than they did on that map. Maps from any mode could be replayed in such a manner, but completion of these maps would not count for unlocking stuff or highscores. This would also allow players to retry a map that they think they could've done better on and attempt more ideal solutions while learning how to play.
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:Seconding this, and display the seed number during the game.  That way we can always recreate the game when someone posts a screenshot and asks questions about it.
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Limiting WEYTWUT to unexplored area would be a definite plus.
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DGM: Nandrew, I assume you're reading this since I got the link for this wiki from you.  Are you going to share the source, so we can play with ideas you reject?  Failing that, would you use the discussion page and comment on which ideas being presented here that you're considering using?  I've got more ideas for the glyph system I suggested, but there's no point in talking about it if it will never be implemented.
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Jabberwock: One suggestion for the dodge - as it seems it is one of very few random elements after the game starts (maybe beside the Imp teleports), it is a little bit out of place. What if the order of the enemy miss was predetermined instead of random? That is, one of the five enemy hits misses - I receive hit no.1, 2 etc., and the no. 5 always misses... Would certainly make it more strategic.
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fall_ark: This might sound a little cheap but... how about adding a "minimum gold" bonus? Or change the saved gold system as a whole. I mean, after unlocking the Goblin race it becomes super easy to gain 50~70 gold in a few minutes, and before that I used to choose rogue to do some rounds of hoarding...It just feels a bit tedious. Or I'm just lazy and spoiled...
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Stormy: What about highlighting the classes who beat a particular dungeon. Just like it's currently done with the standard dungeon, but extended to the others, when the cursor hovers over the buttons.
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Fizanko: to make every gods more usefull and varied, maybe having them spawning a glyph or a new trait for the player, unique to them after the player successfully attacked and destroyed the other deities altars, giving alternatively an incentive for the player to explore the whole dungeon to find every altars.
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Could then be used to balance the less interesting gods by having them spawning a more interesting glyph/trait.
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Going4Paladin: The monk needs a buff, his last 2 skills are lovely, but when he loses half attack, he has nothing to kill with.... maybe he needs a poison immunity???
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:The monk really doesn't need a buff.  His DIAMOND BODY skill already allows you to take half damage from the start, and you're doing half damage to the enemy, so fights tend to simply take twice as long.  But HAND TO HAND just has your Damage Bonus start at -50%.  Each Attack Powerup you find or Glyph you convert as a Human increases this by 10%.  So after 5 Glyphs/Powerups, you're back to base damage, whilst your enemies are still doing half damage to you.
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:The net result of these two abilities is that every boost to Damage Bonus has *double* the effect than for other characters, and that's one hell of a buff.  The same applies to any extra Physical or Magical Resistance items you may eventually find in the shops: they provide twice as much help to the Monk because his resistance is already so high.
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:So yes, while he can be a little difficult to work with at Level 1 due to damage being rounded down, he swiftly gets much stronger as you gain sources of Damage Bonus.  And his enhanced Health Regen makes hit and run tactics much much easier. --[[Special:Contributions/94.7.130.253|94.7.130.253]] 05:48, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
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Fizanko : i agree with DGM up there, i believe IMAWALL is in a need of a rework in my opinion, as in its current status it brings no advantage in comparison to every other glyph that cost a base 5 mana or even less, as by using it not only you deny yourself the xp of a petrified monster (and in Desktop Dungeons you need every xp you can) but by mistake you can block you own way.
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The only use is for The Earthmother deity, but still i don't see the +1 HP gain to balance the xp you will not get from the petrified monster and the blocked path it creates, or just converting it for a bonus.
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I can see and understand that to be a difficult glyph to balance, but i think it should count for a kill (so delivering the xp) when used for monsters that are below your own level (so you can't use it on a boss to get an "easy win"), or making it only in a limited amount of use so you can't overuse it.
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To round out the tier 1 classes, how about showing the locations of the altars to the priest, and the stores to the thief?
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On the main menu, rather than having to look at the rollover text to see if you've beaten a challenge with a class, instead give the dungeon selection buttons boarders like the class selection buttons get after beating the normal dungeon. Also, give the transmuter et al. classes boarders after beating the normal dungeon, don't leave them out.
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Can I suggest a menu redesign with a 'Go!' button, as opposed to simply clicking on the dungeon you want? That way, you can select each dungeon by clicking on it and the borders will show up around all the classes you've beaten it with for the dungeon you currently have selected. It'd streamline that aspect a bit.
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Resistances are a pain to the mental math, how about displaying the actual numbers, for example, if I'm a monk, a monster's rollover would say "Attack:41 (20)" Admittedly it's easy for monks, but when dealing with 30% resistances, that is harder.
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:Agree.  This applies to both the damage the monsters will deal to you after Monk bonus, Tower Shields, etc. and the damage you'll deal to them after their resistances, your Berserker bonus, etc.  This can either shown in the monsters Health Line or next to your attack value. --[[User:Twinge|Twinge]]
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There really should be a iPhone/iTouch version of Desktop Dungeons. I think it would be awesome on the platform. Dont know how hard to port it is but you know, a suggestion:D
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zreaperz-
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:or even for Android. It is definitly the kind of time sink i'd love to have in my pocket
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Some more Random idea:
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Other Offensive spells (Difficult to implement, because the fireball is pretty well balanced at the moment)
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Have 1 off glyphs that can be cast once, so a big Fireball explosion, maybe 12 damage per level for example?
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Have an offensive spell that either ties in with Max Mana, or your attack Power...?
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A spell like poison, maybe "STASIS" that binds the enemy and as you explore the dungeon it loses health. Although this would be like poison, maybe to balance it you lose health as well?
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Attack Ideas:
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Make a class like a thief or ranger, that does ranged damage. How i see this working would be 1 "free" attack before the monster retaliates and fights back. Conversely some monsters could have the "Cover or Awareness" ability that counters this.
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Class ideas:
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There are classes that only use the health stat and not mana, how about the other way around? SO only mana? Maybe an Angel, or Elemental? Also for these classes have them do something usefull with the Mana or Health potions/Power ups..
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Other random ideas:
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Wildmage: When you use a mana potion you get a random effect.
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-----------------
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Achievements: This game needs something to keep us addicted after getting the last unlock. The high score list won't do it for all players, but an achievements list would. It also provides a handy point system for a 'trait' system.
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Traits: Let players select benefits and penalties before each match. This can require 'points' (A certain number to start with, with more available as you complete achievements, or simply one point per dungeon beaten with each class) have an impact on the final score, or both. Example: Jerry selects four traits before his game. Heavy Handed, Explorer, Blackballed, and Veteran.
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Heavy Handed prevents him from gaining any Dodge or First Strike abilities, but doubles damage dealt to creatures below level 5. (Score x 1)
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Explorer adds 50% to health regeneration and +1 to mana regeneration from exploration. (Score x0.5)
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Blackballed removes all shops from the map. (Score x1.25)
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Veteran adds +1 xp per kill, as per the Fighter trait. (Score x0.8)
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Jerry finishes the map with a score of 28000. After multipliers, he is awarded a final score of 14000 to submit to the leaderboards.
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Brainstorming new glyphs:
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* IPHEELWEEK (Weaken) - Lower monster's attack power by 10%.
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* WARIZHEL (Mass Charm) - Every monster makes an attack on an adjacent monster. (High-level monsters act first, targeting the lowest-level monster they can reach.)
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* HIVOLTIJ (Chain lightning) - Deals 3 damage per level and leaps to any adjacent monsters.
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* IKANSI (Selective Amnesia) - Unexplore twelve random tiles. (12 == casting cost.)
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* BEGON (Banish) - Instantly kill monster of lower level. Add their level to max health.
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* CRAMBLEDEG (Warp world) - Scramble the dungeon. (Generate a new dungeon layout with the same number of monsters, shops, runes, etc. as the present.) Vanishes after one use.
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* TOKIWOTOMARE (Time Stop) - Your next attack is completely unopposed. (Special monster abilities such as blink and life steal also turn off for the duration.) The strain on your body permanently reduces your damage bonus by 10%.
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* NOTUITZME (Polymorph) - Transform monster into random monster of the same level.
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* GLOINZADARK (Destruction) - Cause mass destruction centered on you. (Destroys all walls, shops, altars and floor objects within 3 tiles. Monsters 1 tile away take 6 * level damage, 2 tiles away take 4 * level damage, 3 tiles away take 2 * level damage. You go to 1 life.) Vanishes after one use.
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* SLEPOVREZN (Monster Migration) - Create new monster of level 1 to 9 somewhere in dungeon.
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* CUMONDEN (Enhance Monster) - Level up target monster.
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* IZALWAZRITE (Summon Store) - Summon a phantasmal merchant. (One chance to purchase a random item.)
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* BULKUP (Enhance Strength) - Increases base damage and max health by 1.
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* INRI (Holy Symbol) - Drive monster back with 50% knockback damage, or 100% against undead.
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* ZENERCARD (Clairvoyance) - Detect the location of any items and monsters within 3 tiles.
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* NOUSIIT (Invisibility) - Gives 50% dodge chance for your next action.
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When I killed my first boss, I wasn't sure what to do next and spend several minutes clicking around before realising I should 'retire'. It would have been nice if the retire button was replaced with 'victory!' in those circumstances.
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I'd love to be able to use the arrow keys to navigate! -- [[Special:Contributions/99.238.53.245|99.238.53.245]] 16:58, 27 March 2010 (UTC)
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: yes. Please.
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Achievements:
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* GODLESS - Follow no deity.
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* AGNOSTIC - Follow all three available gods in a single run.
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* SKIMMER - Reveal less than 50% of the map.
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* PACIFIST - Killed boss but more than half of total monsters alive.
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* THRIFTY - Didn't visit store.
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* SCROOGE - Exited dungeon with 30 or more gold then you entered with.
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Much like how vampires follow Dracul for free, Binlor should do something special for dwarves who follow him. [[User:Neongrey|Neongrey]] 03:11, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
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The dungeon specific monsters (naga, imp, vampire and armour) are pretty fun guys, and it would be nice to see them in the main dungeon. Perhaps as a reward for beating their dungeon with [x] classes.
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Petrification doesn't have any purpose but to please the Earthmother god. And the Earthmother doesn't have any purpose other than to make petrification useful. That's not good!
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SIMPLE IDEA:
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Make petrification work in same way as a gorgon's death gaze: it counts as a kill in every way, but only works on monsters of less than some % health. Now it's a very situational assassination skill -- super-good against some bosses (like Super Meat Man) and super-bad against others (like Gharbad.)
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But this doesn't help that the gorgon class' innate petrification is either trivial (so long as they keep their ENDISWAL glyph) or game-wreckingly harmful (if they don't.) So:
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MORE COMPLEX IDEA:
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Stoned monsters become statues which the character can push around the dungeon sokoban style.
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Love the game. Gushing aside, criticisms:
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Classes:
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The best classes seem to be "mix" classes: thief and priest, for example. Classes that rely primarly on melee or magic (fighter, wizard) seem to have their work seriously cut out for them.
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Fighter is awful, and could use a buff. Perhaps "regenerate" his death save? (every 5 kills?)
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Wizard is poor, even with the -1mp: largely because (imo) the only way to kill things with magic is fireball, and at high levels fireball does not scale well at all. Perhaps this more an issue with fireball, though.
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Vampire is ungodly powerful, largely down to it having fireballs out the wazoo. Perhaps remove its ability to use magic? (and give it a buff somewhere else?)
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Crusader seems weak to me... probably because momentum caps out. I have a hellish time defeating bosses with crusader, because after the first hit, damage drops significantly. Also, fireball causes momentum to reset - not sure if thats intended, but it renders fireball pretty much useless.
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Glyphs:
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PISOF and WEYTWUT are both pretty much useless (unless you get trapped, but even still, id rather have pretty much anything else).
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IMAWAL as noted many times above, is awful. Other people have good suggestions.
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LEMMISI, even with the trick, I feel is underpowered: largely because once you run out of spaces to explore, it becomes useless. Perhaps reduce the MP cost to 1? Incidentally, it also causes vampire life leech to trigger. Not sure if thats meant.
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APHEELSIK makes or breaks games, for many classes. Taking down Super Meat Man (or many others) becomes trivial with poison: if you dont have it, it becomes incredibly difficult (in some cases impossible - try take down Super Meat Man with a wizard, for example). As a possible alternative to messing around with poison, nerfing Boss Regen rate may help "fix" several aspects of the game.
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BLUDTOPOWA is awful at high level. ~16 health for 1 MP is a rip. Increasing the MP gain or reducing the health drained (perhaps by half) would make it less awful, and would buff magic users.
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BURNDAYRAZ as mentioned above, doesnt scale well. Magic users generally feel gimped as a result.
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BYSSEPS could probably do with a "fail" if already cast. Not really important.
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Bosses:
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Some bosses seem significantly easier than others. Part of the problem is what boss you get randomly assigned: perhaps thats just the nature of the game, but if i see a Tower of Goo as a melee class, I may as well just restart. Super meat man seems horrendously impossible without poison.
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Other stuff:
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As others have said, having to farm between games is sucky and encourages grinding. Remove the gold cap, start off every game with the bonus you would've got for clearing the crypt multiple times, and dont have gold transfer. Also, rather than having certain squares cause popups (such as altars or bosses), why not have the information appear at the side (and disappear if you move away)? It seems to break the game, and after the 300th boss conversation, I dont really care what they have to say. (Also, I had to fight a boss who was beside an altar, using poison. Every time I moved beside him, I got an altar popup. Bleh)
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Anyway, as I said, love the game and hope it continues to improve. --[[Special:Contributions/82.35.212.80|82.35.212.80]] 19:22, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
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Revision as of 09:22, 22 April 2012

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Suggestions about this wiki

Suggestions for the game interface

  • Make a tile selection overlay, so we can avoid misclicking a tile.
  • Remove the "death/safe/victory" system. It gets too easy when you can just rely on that.(Disagree) [Maybe as an option, but not generally.]
  • Add a way of turning off the custom cursor, which causes lag on some slower computers.(Seconded)
    • When the game window loses focus, the mouse cursor does not get shown when you move it inside the game window again. This might be fixed by the above suggestion.
  • As mentioned before, add diagonal movement for arrow keys. Right now it is possible, but not optimal to use the keys because you have to use the mouse to access certain places.
  • Hotkeys: P for Pray/Pick Up/Purchase, numbers to choose between worship options, Space exits the Game Over screen.
  • Delayed keypress to allow for diagonal movement without numerical keyboard.(Yes,yes,yes!)
  • Please, please, PLEASE include WASD functionality. Arrow keys/mouse or just clicking around both feel awkward.

Suggestions for the Gods system

  • Taurog followers get 50% HP restoration from any potion and no mana restoration.
  • New boon for Glowing Guardian: +25% damage to undead.
  • Increase initial piety when joining Mystera Annur.
  • New boon for Earthmother: double HP regeneration.
  • Give -5 max HP for joining to Dracul, but don’t increase hero level.
    • I would prefer -5 max HP OR -15% to -20% max HP, whichever bigger. That way, it encourages joining early on, making for risky gameplay. In fact, all of Dracul's boon should work like that. Currently, the costs for boons are rather weak.
  • Reduce piety gain for teleporting glyph when worshipping Tikki Tooki.
  • a stupid one, but maybe host a contest and the winner is made a god in DD, with stats s/he decides.
  • Taurog should not ban the usage of WONAFYT. (Seconded)
  • Converting should be consolidated to a single slot. Having to take up a slot for each god is redundant. It should also be less expensive to convert in the first place.
  • Binlor Ironshield should only grant 1.6 piety gain for wall destroying with ENDISWAL. This can be accomplished easily by giving out 8 piety gain for every 5 walls destroyed.
  • Jehora Jeheyu should give better piety gain outside of WEYTWUT
  • Tikki Tooki's First Strike boon needs it's cost reduced significantly. It's nowhere near as good as the Poison Strike boon. And forget about converting from Pactmaker. I'd rather have another boon.
  • Each god should have their own unique altar sprite, especially since the new build is trying to be more visually informative. It would also be awesome if some character art of the god was pictured next to their list of boons.

Suggestions for the Scoring system

  • Make score not dependent on time.
  • For ranked matches, have it throw out any run over 15 minutes. These runs will never score high up anyway, and it makes fixing the current scoring measure unneccessary.
  • Unstoppable is grossly overrated at 2000 points. You're already getting a lot of score for having killed the monsters, and this amounts to double-dipping the same activity. It's not even that hard to do; unless you're down to the wire and have no resources left, you're essentially over the hump and it's all downhill after killing the boss. Other achievements such as "Cocky, aren't you?" are significantly more difficult to pull off.
  • Give us a bonus for never worshipping gods or buying items. A bad set of shops/alters can be a big handicap, and being able to abstain altogether for a score boost would be a nice equilizer.
  • "Tooth and Fricken Nail" should not be earned when using death protection. This method is just too easy to perform.

Suggestions for the glyph system

  • Reduce ENDISWAL mana cost by 1-4 points.
  • Reduce CYDSTEPP mana cost by 1-2 points.
    • CYDSTEPP is horribly overpowered; if anything it needs a cost increase of 1 to 2 points (let the Warlord use it for 10; everyone else should need a mana powerup to use this glyph)
  • Reduce PISORF mana cost by 2-5 points.
  • Reduce BURNDAYRAZ mana cost by 1 point.
  • Make IMAWAL spawn only if there's a Earthmother altar around.
    • Just grant IMAWAL upon worshipping the Earthmother, and never make it spawn in. Really it needs a secondary benefit; otherwise its only use is appeasing the Earthmother.
  • Add a glyph that allows you to Scry a part of the dungeon without actually exploring it. You could make it random, but instead of random spots, it reveals a 3x3 or 4x4 somewhere around the map each use.
  • An "undo" spell. You could call it "UPZIDAYZI" or something. I can't count the number of times I've made a game losing mistake just because I've misclicked. You could keep undoing until you ran out of mana, but would not be able to extend this with mana potions since you would just "undo" their usage, and obviously wouldn't be able to undo death.

General suggestions

  • Remove the gold keep between levels. As it is pointless since one can farm gold with some good characters. (seconded; looking at you goblin + any T3 class)
    • This would also allow us to "score" based on accumulated gold.
  • Starting gold could be set to 50 Gold, and gold piles could give more gold (5 + lvl/2).
  • Online play would be neato. Maybe Co-Op and Versus. (Disagree, I don't think that would work to well for a game like this, especially one that's meant as a coffee-break/on your Iphone, sort of thing. Perhaps what your looking for instead, is some sort of party gameplay where you get to use multiple characters. Maybe 3?)
  • Settings or configuration of some sort, perhaps with options similar to other roguelikes, would be a good idea.
  • Once again, carry-over gold is a pretty ineffective part of the game right now. I would suggest removing it, increase the amount of gold per pickup during dungeons, and add a carry-over stat for minimum gold and have it increase via special dungeon wins the same way maximum gold does now. Right now, gold pick ups don't matter much mid-dungeon, even if you waste quite a few, but you still want the maximum gold value to matter.
  • Add "traps". Invisible to player they do damage when stepped on, if player lives & tiles have been revealed health & mana is added as normal. Trap is now visible but will still do damage each crossing. 3 types for increasing difficulty; pit,spiked pit,poisoned spiked pit. IMAWAL fills in pits removing trap. Some characters have 'detect trap' trait allowing them to see traps before stepping on them. 'detect trap' boon for earthmother. earthmother gives piety for traps removed with IMAWAL as her goats are now safe :) (this also makes imawal & earthmother more attractive)(If they considered using traps, they could also add trapdoors that forced a player into one of the new minidungeons)
    • Walking over an invisible trap with a low HP character right after a tough battle and dying right then and there would be really annoying. Definitely make traps visible all the time. These would also make playing a 1st level vampire an exercise in frustration, but if visible they could act as a much-needed vampire nerf.

Suggestions for Objects / Shops

  • Make health potions and vampiric items cheaper in shops.
    • How much cheaper can health potions go!? They cost 12 gold.
  • Add the number of health/mana restored by the potion to it's tooltip. (SECONDED) [THIRDED]
  • Give Troll Heart some more benefit. The benefits it grants trickle in too slowly and are rarely meaningful even for a rogue.
  • Lower the cost of Bonebreaker. 29 gold for the effect of a 2 mana glyph is a joke, especially with Band of Courage offering a the effect of a 10 mana glyph for only 20 gold.
  • Give some sort of penalty to buying zombie dog. 1 GP for death protection is a ridiculously good deal.
  • Remove the option for shops to sell WEYTWUT; most players would prefer to restart if they're penned in then blow 50 gold and gamble they end up somewhere useful. Sell a more interesting glyph in its place, like LEMMISI, APHEELSIK or CYDSTEPP.
  • Wicked Guitar's downside is so steep it's almost never beneficial, especially at that high price point.

Suggestions for the Classes/Races

  • Add a class (such as "Explorer" or "Spelunker") that semi-reveals tiles 2 spaces away from the character, showing the player what is on the tile without uncovering it.
  • Number of gold gained by Tinker for killing monsters depends on monster’s level (divided by 2, rounded up).( If this was incorporated, it would probably round down instead)
  • Halfling and gnome have not bonus in potion count, but bonus in potions effectiveness.(about 60% instead of 40%)
  • Mana potions restore some (20-30%) health for berserkers.
  • Add a race that converts glyphs to piety. (Seconded)
    • Such a race really screams "restart until I get the alter I want".
    • And Golbin doesn't already scream " Restart until I get the shops I want?". Honestly, when you make a characters, as long as it isn't to easy to use, the amount of restarting the player would WANT to do (not need to do) shouldn't be taken into account as long as the class is still fun.
  • Increase goblin gold when converting glyphs to something like 4+level.
    • So long as we can enter the dungeon with a whopping 160 gold, the goblin will never be anything more than a method to cheese gold farming.
  • Do not consume blood when a blood mage with full health steps on it.(Seconded) [THIRDED]
  • Add something akin to an amazon race, so that some female characters get thrown into the mix before someone inevitably asks for a female portrait of every character in the game come retail launch.
  • Priest starts with either all altars on map, or choice of god from the get-go.
  • Make a class that can only live for so many actions before dying
  • Fighter's Pit Dog should be changed so that you have either kill 10 enemies or kill an enemy above your level to gain death protection. (Seconded)
  • Thief should lose Survivor and gain the ability to steal from stores. It should be an option under buy and it works 50% of the time. Currently Stabber and Survivor make it way too easy to conserve potions, making any dungeon a breeze. Plus Survivor, it's rather unrougelike ability.(Voted down, the amount of randomness in the game should be decreased, plus, the concequence for this type of choice could make or break a game consistantly)(it would make or break the game as much as Dodge would)(An average of a handful of free hits a game vs half the items on your map potentially free are two completely different bags of candy, my friend.)
  • Speaking of Survivor, Health Potions should not cure Mana Burn and Mana Potions should not cure Poison. Also cut the amount of mana Health Potions heal and vice versa.
  • Survivor and Hoarder should become it's own class, the Treasure Hunter. Add the ability to see items on the map an it's a solid class
    • The Thief kind of is the treasure hunter you're describing. It's just poorly named.
  • Martyr should have first strike properties. Otherwise it's a joke. ( It's definitely not a joke with death protection, my friend.)(Except that it doesn't work with Death Protection either.)(My bad, you are correct, but at the same time, Martyr, as the name implies, is only useful once in a game, but when it is useful ITS REALLY USEFUL, when you are facing down a boss, it essentially does have first strike, you die, but you get credit for the kill)
  • Fearless is bad on Crusaders and needs to be replaced with something better. I would suggest something similar to Berserker's Bloodlust or the ability to spawn more Attack Boosters.
  • I don't remember if this was already suggested, but BURNDAYRAZ should not break Momentum
    • This would make it too easy to keep momentum. It's a liability, but a fitting liability.
    • Maybe casting fireball halves your current momentum? Replace the half with anything, but fireball should not be completely oppossed to the crusader's playing style(different user, btw).
  • Bloodmage with Power Hungry and BLUDTUPOWA currently do not jive very well. I propose that they lose Power Hungry and gain the ability to ignore magic resistance.
  • Meanwhile, Power Hungry along with the extra damaging BURNDAYRAZ ability and automatically summons BURNDARYAZ to your feet should be made into it's own class
    • Automatically summoning fireball is what the wizard will essentially be in the next version, the wiz will spawn two on the map and have a weighted chance of finding one early. Remember, the wiz can kill lvl 1's without magic, so he doesn't need it immediatly, no one really does.
  • Transmuter is cheap. I suggest that you only get HP when you destroy 5 walls as opposed to getting HP every time you destroy one wall.
    • Just raise the cost of ENDISWALL for him. If he runs out of mana, he has to explore to keep healing. Right now, if he has sufficient mana he can almost invariably finish his target before he runs out.
  • Vampires should have a higher costing BURNDARYAZ spell. Like 8 HP.
    • The spell cost is about right at the 1st level, but doesn't increase fast enough towerds the higher levels.
  • Maybe add a Ranger class? Comes with a glyph that deals physical damage without retaliation, but costs 8 gold instead of mana per cast. Then make it so that he deals less damage with BURNDAYRAZ?
  • Building off of the above idea, perhaps there could be a class that uses gold to cast glyphs, "Mercenary" or something, but has low health and attack?

Still uncategorized

  • Make a mode with several dungeon levels (except campaign) like in classic roguelike games.
  • Give some gold for boss slaying.
  • Make monster stats specific; a bit various for every monster. For example, a monster of type x of level y can have random HP value from 50 to 65 and random attack from 20 to 25. It will make game a bit more unpredictable and interesting.
  • Linux support. (Seconded, though I guess that this is up to the guys behind Unity. Also it works decently in Wine.)
  • Special Dungeon: Colliseum. This special dungeon has no reward for completion and is unlocked after winning (AND SUBMITTING) a ranked game. This dungeon allows you to create your own dungeons and put them up for download for other players, the same way you can with tilesets currently. The control you have over the dungeon is over the types and amounts of monsters appearing( by lvl, so if I want all the lvl 1's in the dungeon to be goblins, I can), but not over the labrynth layout and the unlocks the player can bring in. You can also design your own boss ( or two bosses, I suppose) based on the normal bosses, but with variable special qualities, similar to the campaign bosses. Participating in this process might unlock a new class or some other bonus. This would help introduce new players to the DD community and can prove to be an even greater challenge on top of the campaign.
  • Save and view replays. The game would automatically record the player's actions and give the option to save or view it upon death or retirement. When viewing a replay, the player would only be allowed to move forward or back one action at a time and to mouse over objects for information.
  • A new monster, possibly for a special dungeon, that can reflect BURNDAYRAZ damage back to the player. ( Unless it still took damage from the spell, burn would essentially be completely useless, so why not make it just plain immune to the spell? )
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