Exclusive Subletting

[Joist]

Soko-trolls was in magma mines. I didn't find a new one in the west, I think that druid you can buy XP off is the "rare west" one.

[unentschieden]

IT´d be nice if the godunlock subdungeons were reformed to be viable as permanent subdungeons with their own rewards. The godunlock would just be a firsttime extrathing.

[Darvin]

Taurog and Tikki Tooki's subdungeons are blatantly overpowered because of the massive amount of exploration space they afford. Dracul's and GG's, if not for the point of no return and status debuffs respectively would have the same issue. Pactmaker, Jehora Jeheyu, and Earthmother would require a massive beneficial effects since they begin fully explored.

Mystera and Binlor would be the only deities that this idea would lend itself well to, and Mystera's subdungeon is already very similar to zombie money anyways...

[Joist]

So, I had a pretty much perfect wizard run. BLUDTOPOWAH, APHEELSIK and MA. Woot.

[The Avatar]

Purist! Nice job! It's a shame you didn't get hoarder too. That would have been the ultimate.

[Joist]

Ha! Maybe, but you really need 20 mana to get the fire fire fire poison combo. Without conversions I would be stuck with fire fire poison.

Wait, now that I say that it may not be necessary.

Using 60 mana I can do the 3-1 3 times or the 2-1 4 times. That's 9 fires vs 8 fires. Doesn't seem like a lot of a change at all. I can hit 15 mana without conversions using MA (75 piety tots) and mana boosters.

It does have an effect on mana pots and schadenfreude but if you are going for feeling parched and specialist then you can't use the pots anyway. Oh and I guess you can't take the schadenfreude if you are going purist and you can't buy the schadenfreude anyway if you are doing miser.

Ima play with this.

edit: Went pretty well, got BLUDTOPOWAH first go but no APHEELSIK. APHEELSIK would really be necessary for harder dungeons than Hobblers. BLUDTOPOWAH not so much if you find the boss early (assassin proves that). Ding! Max! would also be easier outside of Hobblers. Warmonger and Faithless are the only two you'd not be able to get.

[The Avatar]

I was about to say you beat SLIME PITS HOARDER WITHOUT APHEELSIK?!, but then I realized it was hobblers hold. Nice job with the medals.

[gjaustin]

It does have an effect on mana pots and schadenfreude but if you are going for feeling parched and specialist then you can't use the pots anyway. Oh and I guess you can't take the schadenfreude if you are going purist and you can't buy the schadenfreude anyway if you are doing miser.

Schadenfreude, Reflex, Quicksilver, and Whupaz don't prevent you from getting Feeling Parched.

Only health and mana potions affect it. That's how I got a +44 Trisword and Feeling Parched in the same run

[Lujo]

Yeah, Joist is really putting an effort into dismantling the game (thumb's up).

However, I think there should be a thread about curbing the power curve a bit, since there were a bunch of important long-overdue consensuses all over the place, thanks to his and Avatar's efforts.

How about a thread with the following requests (and discussions thereoff)

1) Fix crusader issues - so we can see/prove wether the insane catapulting is a "Crusader is imba" issue. I think it's bigger than that, but Crusader might still be super-efficent due to bugs.

2) Fix burndayraz issues - again, what Joist has been doing with that thing is absurd in and off itself. We can't have a proper "appropriate challenge level" (not to say balance, to avoid "ITS SINGLEPLAYER!" trolling) discussion if you can mop the floor everywhere with a starting glyph.

3) See if and how the end game content can be made challenging in ways other than making people rely on tactics that are applicable elsewhere, and especially tactics which end up "teaching" players that ignoring content is the way to go.

4) Bring monsters in line a bit, so "strategy" doesn't necessarilly devolve into searching for an equivalent of Goats and slaughtering them. There has to be more ways to play this game than that.

5) Nerfing the damned AA's, in any case.

Enough people ok with this?

[Bloggorus]

Yeah, Joist is really putting an effort into dismantling the game (thumb's up).

However, I think there should be a thread about curbing the power curve a bit, since there were a bunch of important long-overdue consensuses all over the place, thanks to his and Avatar's efforts.

How about a thread with the following requests (and discussions thereoff)

1) Fix crusader issues - so we can see/prove wether the insane catapulting is a "Crusader is imba" issue. I think it's bigger than that, but Crusader might still be super-efficent due to bugs.

2) Fix burndayraz issues - again, what Joist has been doing with that thing is absurd in and off itself. We can't have a proper "appropriate challenge level" (not to say balance, to avoid "ITS SINGLEPLAYER!" trolling) discussion if you can mop the floor everywhere with a starting glyph.

3) See if and how the end game content can be made challenging in ways other than making people rely on tactics that are applicable elsewhere, and especially tactics which end up "teaching" players that ignoring content is the way to go.

4) Bring monsters in line a bit, so "strategy" doesn't necessarilly devolve into searching for an equivalent of Goats and slaughtering them. There has to be more ways to play this game than that.

5) Nerfing the damned AA's, in any case.

Enough people ok with this?

What he said ^^^^