Preparations. How to do it?

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Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Kuranes on Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:45 am

I would just like my fellow players help me shed some light on some of the preparations. Because as it is now the only preparations I really use is the Fine Sword, Magnet: Fire, Preservance Badge, Schadenfreude Potion and Compression- or Translocation Seal. And on the odd occation a Bet on Boss, Sword or Shield.

So I'm wondering if your insight can help explain the posibilities and uses of the more (to me) obscure preparations?

Smugglers Den, how is that used? And what about Patches? God Altars? The Booster Charge prep? The Less and Extra Glyphs? Slayer Wand? Bear Mace? And what items are good, non-boss and "locker worthy" apart from the Fine Sword which is about the only one I use.
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Fran on Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:11 am

Think about the following until a vet appears and shows you the true power of powergaming:

Smugglers Den:
All about the extra exploration space. You ignore it at the start and use it later for some preserved popcorn and healing.

Patches:
Many players prep a burn salve along with it and keep patches until they get mana burned (because thats really the worst penatly to work around). Then use the burn salve and convert him. For classes like vampire or crusader you are partly immune against the punishments so its even better.

God Altars:
Well, obviously, that depends heavenly on class and dungeon - only when there are certain aspects that make a certain god really shine. For example, binlor on narrow dungeons to clear the way (labyrinth) or earthmother on maps with much plants (south) or mystera when you know you have to spellcast much anyway (physical strong bosses). Otherwise, you can't really go wrong with an additional altar as it means one more chance to desecrate (more piety) and more options.

Less Glyphs:
Means more CP than normal so if you are playing conversion heavy and can't really use a lot of spells (berserker, vampire) than its a net gain.

More Glyphs:
When you need a certain glyph for your boss-strategy and want to up your chances. It's rather unlikely you don't find it with more Glyphs prepped.

Slayer Wand:
Clearing pathways in narrow dungeons, getting exp from high level enemies you wouldn't have the ressources for otherwise (LvL 8+ Animated Armor), getting trolled by the bridge troll.

Bear Mace:
Knockback for monsters with a lot Death Protections, especially the boss in Halls of Steel.

Personally, I like to locker Yendors Amulet because it makes the early game alot easier and more forgiving when you don't get enough bonus exp due to a lack of skill, at least in vicious. I'd say it drops the difficulty of the dungeon by one so vicious -> hard -> normal -> easy.
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby The Avatar on Sat Oct 06, 2012 12:20 pm

I've been doing a lot of PQI runs recently, and my two most common preps are Namtar's Ward and Altar Preps.

Namtar's Ward: I never knew how great this item was. The ability to get two more hits in is great for 90% classes. I value it over dragon shield for most guys. Dragon Shield is still my number 2 locker prep. The one place where this item is truly magical is for the Bloodmage. The ability to chain a ton of fireballs and then clean up with 2 attacks is incredible. You power level at an EXTREME rate.
Altar Preps: For any non-vicious run, heck I've been known to prep them on Vicious, these are GREAT. The penalties are not actually that bad (I'd put the worst at TT or EM, but that's probably just me). The ability to START a game with a god is a huge boon, not to mention the specific god you want.
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Kuranes on Sat Oct 06, 2012 1:07 pm

Ahh. The slayer wand and patches has been 2 rather obscure preps to me. But I can see the idea of warding yourself against Patches worst effect and the reap the rewards of the others.

I also think I'll have to do a little more looking into the altar preps. :)
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Darvin on Sat Oct 06, 2012 4:56 pm

Fine Sword is a superb preparation, but I wouldn't count out stuff like Martyr Wraps, Trisword, the Dragonshield, or even the simple Elven Boots (though if gold is an issue their prep cost is absurd).

Black Market is a great thief den prep, as well. It allows you to better fuel the Trisword when you have it prepared. Try out the Trilling some time, a halfling with a trisword. Bring along a strength potion and prepare the apothecary so you have four potion shops. If you find him, Tikki Tooki's 2 for 1 potion deal is great for this, and it's entirely possible to get that Trisword into the +40 range.

Patches is a little difficult to work with since he has a random chance of poisoning or mana burning you. The teleportation can also be a problem on more chokey scenarios, but a WEYTWUT or ENDISWAL find will usually solve that. He's a gamble, but his long-term payoff is enormous. Be sure to bring a burn cure potion to deal with the occasional mana burn.

Smuggler's Den is basically about giving you an extra subdungeon to explore. Unfortunately, it will take boosters off the top level so you can't find them until you explore the den. The best way to use this preparation is on scenarios where exploration is at a premium and having a "reserved" area is important. Bloodmages who need BLUDTUPOWA fodder are a good example.

As for prepping gods:
Glowing Guardian: a reliable standby; being able to begin worship at level 1 effectively compensates for the lower piety gain.
Mystera Annur: the lower piety gain will hurt you, but if you're only taking a hit or two of magic, refreshment, and then converting out you should be fine. This will be a much more significant penalty if you want to purchase more than one of her expensive boons.
Tikki Tooki: don't touch him; he's finicky to maintain piety with under early worship conditions even at the best of times, but this makes things much worse.
Jehora Jeheyu: make sure you bring along a compression seal, a burn salve, and a fortitude potion. Getting over the petition hump and that lost inventory slot will be your biggest issue, but like GG starting worship immediately tends to counter-act the hefty penalty in most cases. In more gold-heavy dungeons, be sure to purchase the apothecary preparation; more of your gold will need to go to consumables since your inventory is much more restricted.
Dracul: there's little benefit to early worship from this god, and the long-term penalty to both piety and utility is pretty steep. I'd much sooner prep 4 altars and take my 45% chance of finding him somewhere in the dungeon.
Earthmother: a decent piety farm, and for those who intend to purchase fewer boons the penalty may actually be a bonus since it lets them better fuel clearance. However, EM is heavily reliant on conversion so I'd much rather take 4-altar to gamble for more flexibility.
Taurog: The penalty is easily managable and big T, much like GG and JJ, really benefits from immediate worship. Like Earthmother I'd rather go 4-altar for better conversion options, but for a warmonger or someone who really needs unstoppable fury he works well.
Binlor: If you want to demolish walls and/or have the knockback glyph, Binlor works great. Otherwise, he's kinda been nerfed hard towards the latter end of the beta and the loss of destructible walls will limit your ability to utilize him effectively.


As for the booster preps, I never use them. Too minor of an effect, and your prep is definitely better spent on tweaking your glyph loadout.

The Bezar preps are generally overpriced, but if you need to increase the odds of a specific item appearing then elite items and quest items can be invaluable. The quest items prep is particularly valuable if you strategically choose which ones you unlock. This allows you to dramatically increase the odds of getting exactly the item you want. The apothecary is also great for any potion-fuelled items, and mandatory for non-halfling/gnome trisword users.

For the witch, definitely don't discount any of her potions. Quicksilver and Reflex are awesome, and strength is great when used at the 1st level for a high-level kill. WHUPAZ, of course, is the secret sauce of awesome. Don't be afraid to swap out the health and mana potion for others, and in fact be sure to remember to do this if going for parched.

As for the alchemist, I'd agree that most of the time the one you're interested in is compression. However, don't discount the other ones. The gold boost of the transmutation scroll can really facilitate a buy-out, and translocation can let you pick up a specific item (elites in particular, they're crazy expensive) without having to go for broke. Still, compression is generally the best choice of the lot.
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Kuranes on Sat Oct 06, 2012 5:46 pm

Darvin wrote:Black Market is a great thief den prep, as well. It allows you to better fuel the Trisword when you have it prepared. Try out the Trilling some time, a halfling with a trisword. Bring along a strength potion and prepare the apothecary so you have four potion shops. If you find him, Tikki Tooki's 2 for 1 potion deal is great for this, and it's entirely possible to get that Trisword into the +40 range.


That is awesome, I will have to try that. Also thanks for explaining the god altar preps in detail, a lot of them makes more sense to me now. I were halfway expecting a detailed explaination on your part when starting this thread, glad to see you, and the others as well, deliver. :)
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Sidestepper on Sat Oct 06, 2012 5:50 pm

Trisword: It's like a DIY orc kit. Obvious combos are halfling priest, gnome warlord, or a thief of either race. It's also a good shop pickup for Rogues and Berserkers.

Martyr Wraps: Put it on a Monk or maybe a Paladin and be amazed. Play an orc monk with Taurog with this and you will swear you are playing some kind of rigged debug mode.

Crystal Ball: Too expensive to buy, but amazing as a prep. The best magic support item in the game. It's the kind of thing that you want to locker and veto at the same time.

Fireheart: The only health stacking support item in the game. It lets you do novel things with dwarves, and is interesting with Bloodmages.

Whuurgl (or whatever): A toned down martyr wrap with less power but less complication. Surprisingly good on Wizards.

Smuggler's Den: Handy for Assassins, Warlords, Monks, or other classes that need last minute exploration. The intended effect (gathering low level monsters for you to fight in the beginning) is an artifact of a time when no one really knew how to play the game.

Patches: Best if your class has a way of shrugging off either poison or mana burn. Paladins can ignore poison, Berserkers can sometimes shrug off mana burn, and Crusaders should never take anything else from the Thieves Guild. Halflings and gnomes can power through poison and mana burn respectively, and if you also prepped trisword you'll only be burning potions that you would have been wanted to burn anyway. If your class is highly mana dependent (eg warlord) consider prepping Soul Orb also.

More glyphs: Great synergy with Taurog, Mystera, and Glowing Guardian.

Less glyphs: If you are playing an orc, you want this. When prepping Taurog as an orc, I prefer this to More Glyphs.

Bearmace: Mostly good for mazes, but everyone should try out the SMASH strategy at least once:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2050&p=17323&hilit=SMASHING+SMASH+SMASH+SMASH+SMASH+SMASH#p17323
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Kuranes on Sat Oct 06, 2012 8:27 pm

Sidestepper wrote:Bearmace: Mostly good for mazes, but everyone should try out the SMASH strategy at least once:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2050&p=17323&hilit=SMASHING+SMASH+SMASH+SMASH+SMASH+SMASH#p17323


That is wonderfull!

Sidestepper wrote:More glyphs: Great synergy with Taurog, Mystera, and Glowing Guardian.


I never actually thought of that. But since Taurog, Refreshment and GG work per glyph, getting more glyphs with the same convertion point-pool is an obvious choice.

Sidestepper wrote:Whuurgl (or whatever): A toned down martyr wrap with less power but less complication. Surprisingly good on Wizards.


Heh! Whurrgarbl were one of the core items in my first "real" specialist character build (although it didn't reach the complexity of the SMASH build, but I did feel rather clever). It were back when Dwarf Conversions gave damage reduction. I'd start as a Dwarf Sorcerer with Whurrgarbl, a Shield and Magnet: Fire. I'd be able to stack hits opun hits, with each hit getting stronger due to Burning and dealing extra damage through Mana Shield. And on top of that I could Fireball the enemies for more Burning, and healing which meant even more hits! :D
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby booooooze on Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:11 pm

I'm incredibly lazy. I play DD for fun. I enjoy it. And I don't vary it much.

Here's my default loadout:

Dragonshield/Martyr Wraps: 50/50. I pick one at random, more or less, as the mood strikes.
Black Market/Bet on Boss: black market if it's going to be hard, bet on boss if not.
Extra Altar: money is no object. I gather it is for those who are new to the game and/or inexperienced, but it really isn't. There's no real penalty to throwing in an extra altar, and I find it more fun to play with 4.
Fewer glyphs: 95% of the time. Unless it's a PQI hoarder run, I'm going with this. Make my character build that much better.

Perseverance badge, transloc scroll, elite items, whupazz, reflex, burn salve.


Exceptions: if I'm a vampire or a crusader, Patches. Trilings are fun from time to time (particularly Crusaders).

I'm sure there's better out there; that's just what I do.
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Re: Preparations. How to do it?

Postby Sidestepper on Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:09 am

Here are a few other combos:

Patches, the Slayer Wand, and the Shop Scroll are inexpensive preps that can be used to gain piety with Glowing Guardian, assuming that you have no 'real' need for the Blacksmith, Bazaar, and Thief prep-lines.

Transmutation + Sword (the blacksmith prep) lets you start out with 25 extra gold. This can be strong if you are also prepping Trisword, Alchemist Scroll, or Crystal Ball. I once did this and ended up being able to sustain a Halfling Priest with both a Trisword and Alchemist Scroll. It was like playing some sort of hacked race that combined the powers of a Halfling, a Dwarf, and an Orc, a "Half-Dworc," if you will.

The ledger scroll from the bank subdungeon is quickly becoming one of my favorite preps. If you find this thing, locker it. You won't be sorry.

The Dwarven Gauntlets are a good generic prep when you know you want something but can't really decide on a specific strategy.

I was able to pull some interesting Hard-level hijinks with the Shield, Platemail, and Earthmother, but I haven't tried this since the Platemail nerf.
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