E3 for everyone!

All things Desktop Dungeons

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby Jedit on Wed Jun 08, 2011 7:43 am

Herborist wrote:I'm not sure I understand. You're upset that they're using a language designed for high-end gaming?


No, he's a Linux user and he's whining because QCF have elected to write their commercial game for the 92% of the market who use Windows or Macs before publishing a version for the 8% who don't.

That said, I'm not sure why he's having a problem. Every Linux user I know is capable of running Windows in a sandbox.
Jedit
 
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:16 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby Nandrew on Wed Jun 08, 2011 8:43 am

guyguy wrote:There are many solution for multi-platform development - from manual porting to different platforms, to open source solutions such as SDL, to multi-platform open languages and proprietary environments - and you just have to find the one that works for you.


I agree. And Unity works for us. :P

Bear in mind that listing multi-platform solutions is one thing, but it's another matter entirely to delve in and investigate their ease and efficacy. We had a look at several options before deciding on a tool (and, funnily enough, Java-based solutions were cut first due to the problems we've had with them in the past :P), and Unity just came out tops for us due to its balance of compatibility, power and ease of use. It doesn't support EVERYTHING, but it does what it does well. :)

A point that a lot of people seem to miss when considering their development tools is the fact that extra effort spent on overcoming technical hurdles is effort that's taken away from many other important aspects of a game's development, such as design and content generation. Even the Desktop Dungeons alpha would not have been made if I didn't have access to Game Maker -- an incredibly easy-to-use and effective tool that until recently only supported Windows PC and still has a somewhat shaky footing on Mac.

Could I have spent the time and effort working in a multi-platform tool instead? Probably, and I've done that sort of thing before. But I've never made any good games that way. Never. And it would be insane of me to embark on a risky, first-time venture with a project on the scale of commercial DD with anything but a tool that I can have absolute confidence in. Multi-platform dev may earn me a broader player base, but it would almost certainly be a much unhappier one too. ;)

I hope this doesn't sound too harsh (it's not intended to do so), but I really think it's important for people to understand these things. I can't speak for my colleagues obviously (they know ... things), but I am an intermediate programmer at best and it would be foolish to try for any Technical Excellence prizes while developing this game. :lol:
User avatar
Nandrew
 
Posts: 569
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:59 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby daddy32 on Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:41 pm

Unity is great! But isn't it a bit pricey, especially phone licenses?

Anyway, the question I wanted to ask:
No keyboard shortcuts?? I find it quite annoying to have to click on the glyphs all the time :(
daddy32
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:12 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby subanark on Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:23 pm

Too bad Java didn't work for you (I'm a fan of desktop Java, been using it for years). At least you aren't using Flash.

I don't really like the fact that you are limited number in the number of potions you can carry. I say this because it's rare not to be able to backtrack and simply leaving them on the ground and picking them up as needed is better than using up more than 1 inventory space for them.

There either needs to be a penalty for picking potions up (e.g. monster regenerate some health when you do so), a penalty for leaving them on the ground (they decay and will be auto-converted if you don't pick them up), or simply allowing unlimited number of potions to be carried (while granting a free inventory space if you exhaust your initial supply of potions).

I also find the protection from death glyph way too powerful, primary since you can cast it, regen mana, and use it again mid combat, allowing 2 additional attacks in which to kill your opponent. Maybe if using it only protected you from the next hit, instead of the next fatal one...? (also allow it to stack with the warrior's bonus).

I find the plants are a neat affect. It does however encourage game play where you simply slash all poisonous and mana burn ones you can see on the screen right before you level where those effects will be removed.
User avatar
subanark
 
Posts: 154
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2011 7:52 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby metroid composite on Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:40 pm

subanark wrote:I also find the protection from death glyph way too powerful, primary since you can cast it, regen mana, and use it again mid combat, allowing 2 additional attacks in which to kill your opponent. Maybe if using it only protected you from the next hit, instead of the next fatal one...?


It's good for exactly the reason you mentioned--basically it lets you have 10 extra MP at the start of a fight...but it has some downsides as well.

1. It's not mana-efficient. (Unless you are human, but even there the healing glyph tends to be more mana efficient).
2. Sometimes you don't want to lose the extra HP--like if you're a Thief and your potions heal both HP and MP, but every time you use a protection from death trigger you drop your HP to 1, wasting some of it.
3. Sometimes you don't want to get hit by the enemy. Poison and Mana Burn enemies jump to mind. (Mana Burn is a problem for the healing glyph too, but poison isn't).
metroid composite
 
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 1:36 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby Nandrew on Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:15 pm

subanark wrote:or simply allowing unlimited number of potions to be carried (while granting a free inventory space if you exhaust your initial supply of potions).


Our solution is possibly going to be something like this.

subanark wrote:I find the plants are a neat affect. It does however encourage game play where you simply slash all poisonous and mana burn ones you can see on the screen right before you level where those effects will be removed.


Yeah, that's generally what happens. Poison and mana burn plants are the "lightweights", however, and the most you'll probably ever see of them is in the Ick Swamp. For other maps, they'll often be mixed up with far more dangerous plants and chances are you'll consider yourself lucky if you can find one or two of them to freely slash before leveling. ;)
User avatar
Nandrew
 
Posts: 569
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:59 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby daddy32 on Fri Jun 10, 2011 4:49 pm

Aaaaand what about those keyboard shortcuts for glyphs?
daddy32
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:12 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby metroid composite on Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:14 pm

Nandrew wrote:Yeah, that's generally what happens. Poison and mana burn plants are the "lightweights", however, and the most you'll probably ever see of them is in the Ick Swamp. For other maps, they'll often be mixed up with far more dangerous plants and chances are you'll consider yourself lucky if you can find one or two of them to freely slash before leveling. ;)


All you'd really need to deter this behavior is to deal some damage along with the poison. Like...instead of just poison it's "when this dies it deals poison, deals 10 damage, and deals 2 MP damage."

You might still kill one or two of these before you level, but only if you're fighting an easy enemy, and you certanly won't be thinking "alright, I'm about to level, time to kill every single poison mushroom on the map!"
metroid composite
 
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 1:36 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby Nandrew on Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:39 pm

daddy32 wrote:Aaaaand what about those keyboard shortcuts for glyphs?


Wheeeeeen we get around to it. :P Don't worry, we know they were popular in the freeware -- dislekcia uses them all the time too. This was just a demo time constraint. :)

I reckon they'll be around in time for the beta release, since this'll probably ease our testing speed as well.

metroid composite wrote:All you'd really need to deter this behavior is to deal some damage along with the poison. Like...instead of just poison it's "when this dies it deals poison, deals 10 damage, and deals 2 MP damage."


Hey, that's a cool idea. It'll be easy to make poison/mana plants do about 3-5 damage apiece ... don't want to push it much further than that though, because they really should -- in theory -- permit even a lvl1 Rogue to hack through.
User avatar
Nandrew
 
Posts: 569
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:59 pm

Re: E3 for everyone!

Postby metroid composite on Fri Jun 10, 2011 6:01 pm

Nandrew wrote:Hey, that's a cool idea. It'll be easy to make poison/mana plants do about 3-5 damage apiece ... don't want to push it much further than that though, because they really should -- in theory -- permit even a lvl1 Rogue to hack through.


You could always make them a percentage based effect. "lose 10% of your HP". Or "Deals 1 damage per your level".
metroid composite
 
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 1:36 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Desktop Dungeons

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: caviar and 5 guests