*SPOILERS* Dailies Thread

[Yoshi]

Dwarf Warlord, Den of Danger

The preps are all set up to give you ridiculous level 1 power for a big kill, but unfortunately the start is pretty clogged up with monsters so you can't really pull it off unless you get lucky with which monsters you teleport with or are willing to burn the wall scroll. Otherwise, not much going on.

[fall_ark]

[~'(^ + ^)'~]

So, yesterday's daily made me realize/learn some new stuff. Also got some questions that came to my mind, any experts who have the answers please enlighten me:

1. Bonus from Strength Potion is only for 1 attack. So casting Pisorf on an enemy (and dealing damage to it) will cause this bonus to go off (Seems to be the case for me in the daily)?

- What about if you deal some damage using Burndayraz, I don't suppose it will cause the bonus to go off.
- How about the bonus from Spirit Sword of Transmuter? Does it also go off when you use Pisorf to deal damage?

2. Does burn stack popping happen before or after enemy's retaliate (when you attack them)?

So is it possible like there are 2 enemies A and B. You don't have enough HP to take a hit from A. You have enough burn stacks on B to kill it when they pop and will level up from killing B. So, is it possible that you get first strike (from Getindare), attack A, level up from killing B from the burn stacks popping, and then have enough HP from the level up to take a hit from A without dying?

- What about Retaliate Fireball? Where is it in the "order of attacks"? Can you have a similar situation to what I describe above? As in you would normally die from the Retaliate Fireball but since burn stacks pop before the Retaliate Fireball, you can level up first and then be able to take the Retaliate Fireball damage?

[Darvin]

Human Thief in Magma Mines
Over the last week or so I've taken to not caring about the leaderboard, and have just been doing "composite" runs where I just try for a generally good finish. Reasonably fast time, reasonably high XP, and a reasonable number of badges. Today's run was interesting; I prepped GG but was immediately conflicted by finding BLUDTUPOWA, which is very useful given the Goo Blobs and Wraiths. I decided to stick with GG and use it to feed his piety, which worked out just fine in the end. Dracul was present for a nice end-game conversion so I was able to clean up and get Unstoppable while remaining Parched.

[Gakato]

[~'(^ + ^)'~]

[Tinker]

In short, I think Gakato is right.

In long: I haven't tested this specific case, but I'm fairly certain the game treats Retaliate:Fireball as it would treat a melee retaliation (for example, assuming no first strike / slow, when you hit a lower-level monster, you attack it first, and if it survives your attack, it can retaliate against you).

So what I believe the order of events to be is:
1. Your fireball attack deals damage
2. Monster retaliates against your attack (if your attack didn't kill it)
3. Your previous burn stacks pop
...in your example, this is where the kill would happen, and then you'd get the XP for it. So you are probably dead by then.
4. New burn stacks get applied to the monster you just fireballed
...etc.

Now, I do know for sure that leveling up happens after combat. So in this sense the above described order isn't even relevant, because you will gain XP for your kill as soon as it happens, but you will only level up after combat (if you gained enough XP to level up). This is what can be exploited to trigger double-kills, gaining XP based on your current level for two simultaneous kills, even if either of those kills would level you up.

[~'(^ + ^)'~]

Actually, I got this "semi-tested" in today's daily, wasn't my intention but seems to prove my point. So I was throwing repeated fireballs at the Physical Immune boss. I got it down to the point where burn stacks popping will kill it. So I cast Getindare and got first strike. I attacked it (indicator says "Win") and I killed it. Since it is immune to physical damage, my attack wouldn't have killed it and it would have dealt the retaliation attack against me first ... but the burn stacks pop before it can retaliate so I managed to kill it.

However, it doesn't matter since you mentioned that leveling (gaining experience) happens only after combat is resolved. So, theoretically, there will never be a case where I can slip in a level up that allows me to survive a retaliate physical attack or retaliate fireball attack.

[I am pretty sure it is not the case that I can survive a hit from the boss, my max HP wasn't enough and I was using Bludtopowa and had lowish HP and MP after the Getindare]

[Gakato]

[~'(^ + ^)'~]

Ok, alright, I rest my case.

The situations I describe shouldn't be able to happen at all.