What items do you forbid?

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What items do you forbid?

Postby Wargasm on Sun Dec 15, 2013 7:25 pm

_Finally_ nailed Warlord Gold and got my second slot for forbids and...I have no idea what to put in it. My first slot is Bloody Sigil, because it comes up useful so rarely I don't find it being around to be worthwhile. Maybe I should let it out for conversion bait purposes, though.

My next guess is Rock Heart. I grab it once in awhile, but the benefit is minimal even when I'm doing a KB/PISORF focused character. It doesn't even make terribly good conversion fodder. I'd drop Spoon in there, but there's a lot of times at level 1/2 that one damage can make a difference and it's a small slot and one gold. I'm planning on getting at least four forbid slots from all the Gold challenges and most of the stuff that was utter crap during the beta got made at least marginally useful, so it's hard to decide what to forbid. Blue Bead probably only helps out half the times I see it, but that's not bad at all.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby lolQuaff on Sun Dec 15, 2013 7:40 pm

The spoon! I know it's just 1 gold but I feel like it's a wasted shop option whenever it pops up. I only have one veto unfortunately.

Bloody sigil is awesome I think, even just for the conversion fodder. It's 8 gold for 45cp I think. That's huge. Also, I'll almost always buy it and use it if I have a regen-fighting focused run going.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Lujo on Sun Dec 15, 2013 7:41 pm

Wargasm wrote:It doesn't even make terribly good conversion fodder.


Eh, compared to what? It being good conversion fodder item is the only reason I keep it around.

Mage plate if you're happy with Elven Boots. Piercing Wand except when you really need it. Spoon is often just a wasted shop. Wharlgarble is arguably not all that good (or is it? Hmmm), you can probably choose either it or Martyr wraps and only take the both into the pool if you know you'll want to stack it. You can probably choose one between Troll Heart and The +10 HP pendant and forbid one and keep the other (they're very diffierent though). There's probably other stuff.

Bloody sigil is better than one'd thing it just depends on what you're playing (and cheap as dirt to pick up with a very food cost/cp ratio)
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Wargasm on Sun Dec 15, 2013 7:50 pm

Well, most of the best conversion fodders are at least 3:1 ratio on CP per GP. Rock Heart is 2:1, which is pretty meh. Whurrgarbl is a good choice to forbid. I never use that thing, but I rarely see it pop up. Health Pendant is also 2:1, and I generally prefer the Troll Heart, especially since its conversion is over 4:1. I might do the Mana Pendant too, as it's also 2:1 and I'd be better with Mage Plate, Elven Boots, Crystal Ball or Dragon Soul basically every time, possibly even Blue Bead.

So looks like I'll probably do Wurrgarbl, Health/Mana Pendant, and Rock Heart, then maybe worry about other stuff if/when I buy the other three slots. Locker slots will come first though.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Darvin on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:00 pm

Rock Heart is 14 GP for 60 CP, a 4.3:1 ratio. This makes it one of the best conversion fodder items in the game.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Lujo on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:01 pm

Wargasm wrote:Well, most of the best conversion fodders are at least 3:1


Which ones are those? And since when? Did these things change or and you trolling?

Isn't Rock Heart somethign like 60 CP for 14 gold?* And Troll heart 65 for thereabouts? What's logic you on, son? (sorry about tone, but you sound convinced and my nubers don't add up)



Also, Whargarble isn't bad at all if you can land a few hits and fireballs, the problem is that you lose the stacks if you attack something else. Otherwise it's bloody strong on a regen fighter, it's just that I don't play them too much these days.

*EDIT: Ninja Darvin ftw.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Darvin on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:06 pm

I wrote a conversion fodder section into the items page of the wiki. I think Balanced Dagger has changed since then, so I'm scumming for its current values and will edit them in if they're above 3:1.

EDIT:
Found it! It's 12 for 44, giving it a 3.67 ratio. That puts it fairly high on the list.
Last edited by Darvin on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby lolQuaff on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:09 pm

I find whrrgarble very effective in burn popping situations against death protection enemies.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Wargasm on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:12 pm

That's...bizarre. I just had one two runs ago and I'd swear in a court of law it converted for 30cp. I can only guess I must have moved the cursor to highlight it, accidentally highlighted something else by a miniscule margin, and saw the wrong CP value. I'll look at the next one long and hard. 14gp's not a bad price for conversion fodder, especially being one gold short of a Schadenfreude potion.

And yeah, Troll Heart's 55 for 16, looks like. I thought it was 65 too. Or maybe the Wiki's off. Whurrgarbl's also 3:1. Hrm. Gloves of Midas are 4.5:1 making it one of the best actually purchasable conversion fodders.

Well, the Health and Mana Pendants are still going and I'm not entirely sold on Whurrgarbl, as it's 45:15 and if I have 15 gold I can afford Schadenfreude unless I've already gotten one. On the other hand, conversion fodder is nice, especially if I start doing Goatperson...

Guh. Decisions.
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Re: What items do you forbid?

Postby Lujo on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:15 pm

Darvin wrote:I wrote a conversion fodder section into the items page of the wiki. I think Balanced Dagger has changed since then, so I'm scumming for its current values and will edit them in if they're above 3:1.

EDIT:
Found it! It's 12 for 44, giving it a 3.67 ratio. That puts it fairly high on the list.


I <3 you. I though I know my conversion fodder like the back of my hand, acess to this list outgh to be stickied.

@:lolQuaf - Whargarble can be huge, huge, huge since it creates sinergy bewteen your fireballs and attack on top of adding damage and not breaking burning as long as you focus one guy. It just doesn't LOOK like something to pick up as it doesn't straight up say +bunch of damage. I underrate it during play :( It's not good conversion fodder tough.

@Wargasm: Stone Heart is like the deffinition of conversion fodder. And maybe the Troll Heart is 55 cp. It used to be 75, then it got nerfed hard, then buffed again.

EDIT: And about Troll Heart - it's not going to help you get off the ground, but the huge deal about it is that it can get you an easy 10-14 hp (for say sanguine or being able to tank a hit), has good CP and most importantly, free's up a slot once you're done with it as opposed to the health pendant. There's advantages to keeping both in the pool, though, but if you're trimming the pool you can take at least on out.
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